Discussion:
What legal right to Gibraltar do the British defend?
(too old to reply)
MM
2017-07-12 14:20:29 UTC
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Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.

Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.

MM

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Jethro_uk
2017-07-12 14:19:45 UTC
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Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't that
an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it back.
MM
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Didn't Spain cede it in perpetuity in the treaty of Utrecht ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht
abelard
2017-07-12 14:41:53 UTC
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On Wed, 12 Jul 2017 14:19:45 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't that
an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it back.
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com
Didn't Spain cede it in perpetuity in the treaty of Utrecht ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht
it is british...so is the isle of sheppey...
R. Mark Clayton
2017-07-12 15:05:40 UTC
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Post by abelard
On Wed, 12 Jul 2017 14:19:45 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't that
an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it back.
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com
Didn't Spain cede it in perpetuity in the treaty of Utrecht ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht
So was the island of Minorca, but we gave that back as part of the Treaty of Amiens in 1802.
Post by abelard
it is british...so is the isle of sheppey...
Perhaps we could swap Sheppey for Minorca...
jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
2017-07-12 14:54:39 UTC
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On Wed, 12 Jul 2017 14:19:45 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't that
an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it back.
MM
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Didn't Spain cede it in perpetuity in the treaty of Utrecht ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht
Why are the Spanish being so hypocritical about Gibraltar when they
have the mirror image enclaves of Ceuta and Melilla on the African
mainland?
- -
"We CAN hide forever."
- Klaun Shittinb'ricks (1940 - ), acknowledging that he will
NEVER prove where he infests or give his real jew name

"Die Juden sind unser Unglück!"
- Heinrich von Treitschke (1834 - 1896)

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out
because I was not a Socialist. Then they came for the Trade
Unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a Trade
Unionist. Then they came for the jews, and I did not speak out
because I did not give a shit. Then they came for me and there
wasn't a single commie bastard left to speak for me."
- Martin Niemöller (1892 - 1984)
MM
2017-07-13 09:07:36 UTC
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On Wed, 12 Jul 2017 14:19:45 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't that
an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it back.
MM
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Didn't Spain cede it in perpetuity in the treaty of Utrecht ?
Yeah, stitched up like a kipper by the British and French working in
tandem for whatever spoils they could get!

MM
Norman Wells
2017-07-13 13:31:21 UTC
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Post by abelard
On Wed, 12 Jul 2017 14:19:45 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't that
an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it back.
Didn't Spain cede it in perpetuity in the treaty of Utrecht ?
Yeah, stitched up like a kipper by the British and French working in
tandem for whatever spoils they could get!
Good work then!
Dan S. MacAbre
2017-07-12 14:44:27 UTC
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Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
MM
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Spain has similar bits of Morocco, I think. Can't remember the name(s)
today. They can't really complain :-)
JNugent
2017-07-12 14:58:13 UTC
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Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
What is now known as Spain was not always so.

The Kingdom of Castile acquired the rest of Spain by dynastic means and
via a war - the war of the Castilian Succession. The various Spanish
monarchies had also re-acquired large territories from the Moors - by
(re-)conquest.

ditionally, Spain, as you probably know, and as well as holding the
Canary Islands (which are clearly part of the African continental
system), also possesses several territories on the African mainland
(enclaves within Morocco).

Why is it acceptable for Spain to consist of and to hold conquered
possessions but not the UK?
j***@gmail.com
2017-07-12 15:00:47 UTC
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Wasn't Gibraltar given to the brits by a Spanish king.

If it were not for the British the Spaniards would be speaking French.
MM
2017-07-13 09:09:40 UTC
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Post by JNugent
Why is it acceptable for Spain to consist of and to hold conquered
possessions but not the UK?
That's for those possessions to argue. I am arguing specifically about
Gibraltar.

MM

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Norman Wells
2017-07-13 13:35:04 UTC
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Post by MM
Post by JNugent
Why is it acceptable for Spain to consist of and to hold conquered
possessions but not the UK?
That's for those possessions to argue. I am arguing specifically about
Gibraltar.
Since possessions can't argue, I assume you mean the residents. That's
handy, because they were asked in a referendum in 2002 when 98.97% voted
against the proposition:

"Do you approve of the principle that Britain and Spain should share
sovereignty over Gibraltar?"
Norman Wells
2017-07-12 15:05:56 UTC
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Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
So what?
Post by MM
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
No, we didn't have any laws about war in those days, and they're a bit
silly anyway. Who would enforce them, and how?

What we had was the very useful 1713 Treaty of Utrecht which ended the
War of the Spanish Succession and ceded Gibraltar to the British in
perpetuity. That's the applicable law.

It's the perfidious Spanish who have repeatedly sought to undermine that
Treaty by repeatedly attacking Gibraltar in three successive wars and
besieging it from time to time. We've fought them off every time, and
of course feel little inclination to give in to such distasteful bullying.

They have no right to it. They're not getting it.

Boo hoo! Too bad.
MM
2017-07-13 09:11:55 UTC
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Post by Norman Wells
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
So what?
Post by MM
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
No, we didn't have any laws about war in those days, and they're a bit
silly anyway. Who would enforce them, and how?
What we had was the very useful 1713 Treaty of Utrecht which ended the
War of the Spanish Succession and ceded Gibraltar to the British in
perpetuity. That's the applicable law.
It's the perfidious Spanish who have repeatedly sought to undermine that
Treaty by repeatedly attacking Gibraltar in three successive wars and
besieging it from time to time. We've fought them off every time, and
of course feel little inclination to give in to such distasteful bullying.
They have no right to it. They're not getting it.
Boo hoo! Too bad.
Just as they were forced to cede it to the UK, we can be forced by EU
negotiations to cede it back.

Think it won't happen? Brexit is far more important to Brexiters than
a lump of rock that isn't ours in the first place.

MM

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Norman Wells
2017-07-13 13:37:13 UTC
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Post by MM
Post by Norman Wells
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
So what?
Post by MM
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
No, we didn't have any laws about war in those days, and they're a bit
silly anyway. Who would enforce them, and how?
What we had was the very useful 1713 Treaty of Utrecht which ended the
War of the Spanish Succession and ceded Gibraltar to the British in
perpetuity. That's the applicable law.
It's the perfidious Spanish who have repeatedly sought to undermine that
Treaty by repeatedly attacking Gibraltar in three successive wars and
besieging it from time to time. We've fought them off every time, and
of course feel little inclination to give in to such distasteful bullying.
They have no right to it. They're not getting it.
Boo hoo! Too bad.
Just as they were forced to cede it to the UK, we can be forced by EU
negotiations to cede it back.
No, we can't be 'forced', nor will we. You see, 98.97% of the
population were against it when they were asked.
Post by MM
Think it won't happen? Brexit is far more important to Brexiters than
a lump of rock that isn't ours in the first place.
What makes you think it's Spain's?
James Harris
2017-07-13 09:51:46 UTC
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Post by Norman Wells
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
So what?
Post by MM
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
No, we didn't have any laws about war in those days, and they're a bit
silly anyway. Who would enforce them, and how?
What we had was the very useful 1713 Treaty of Utrecht which ended the
War of the Spanish Succession and ceded Gibraltar to the British in
perpetuity. That's the applicable law.
It's the perfidious Spanish who have repeatedly sought to undermine that
Treaty by repeatedly attacking Gibraltar in three successive wars and
besieging it from time to time. We've fought them off every time, and
of course feel little inclination to give in to such distasteful bullying.
They have no right to it. They're not getting it.
Boo hoo! Too bad.
And, in fairness, the British government's original reason for keeping
Gibraltar (and Spain's for keeping Ceuta) is not longer anything like as
relevant.

From Britain's point of view, if the _people_ of Gibraltar wanted to be
Spanish then it would be ceded. But they don't.
--
James Harris
Jethro_uk
2017-07-13 09:55:49 UTC
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Post by James Harris
From Britain's point of view, if the _people_ of Gibraltar wanted to be
Spanish then it would be ceded. But they don't.
British governments reactions to what people want is highly variable.
Just ask the (ex) inhabitants of Diego Garcia.
James Harris
2017-07-13 10:05:21 UTC
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Post by Jethro_uk
Post by James Harris
From Britain's point of view, if the _people_ of Gibraltar wanted to be
Spanish then it would be ceded. But they don't.
British governments reactions to what people want is highly variable.
Just ask the (ex) inhabitants of Diego Garcia.
Different circumstances. But I agree that DG should be returned to the
people who lived there and/or their children - with lots of humble pie.
--
James Harris
tim...
2017-07-13 10:39:00 UTC
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Post by James Harris
Post by Jethro_uk
Post by James Harris
From Britain's point of view, if the _people_ of Gibraltar wanted to be
Spanish then it would be ceded. But they don't.
British governments reactions to what people want is highly variable.
Just ask the (ex) inhabitants of Diego Garcia.
Different circumstances. But I agree that DG should be returned to the
people who lived there and/or their children - with lots of humble pie.
it's not in our gift anymore though

we are just the whipping boy for the US here

tim
Post by James Harris
--
James Harris
Basil Jet
2017-07-12 15:10:09 UTC
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Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
Spain will struggle to hold on to Catalonia, never mind trying to
conquer new foreigners to dominate.
Mike Swift
2017-07-12 15:36:51 UTC
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Spain will struggle to hold on to Catalonia, never mind trying to conquer
new foreigners to dominate.
And if the Spaniards and the EU start playing silly buggers over
Scottish independence there's always the Basque regions to keep them on
the straight and narrow.

Mike
--
Michael Swift We do not regard Englishmen as foreigners.
Kirkheaton We look on them only as rather mad Norwegians.
Yorkshire Halvard Lange
tim...
2017-07-12 23:05:09 UTC
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Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
it's how all land was acquired in the middle ages and early modern periods

it is no different to anywhere else that current countries formed before
1945 claim as their own

perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany and Western Ukraine
should be returned to Poland
instead, as just one example

tim

[1] Silesia was take from German as punishment for losing an illegal war
rather than because Poland won an illegal war, but the principle's much the
same
Byker
2017-07-12 23:33:51 UTC
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Post by tim...
perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany and Western Ukraine
should be returned to Poland
instead, as just one example
I wonder how the Russkies would feel about Germany demanding Königsberg
(Kaliningrad) back?

In the mid-19th century, Russia took advantage of Chinese weakness to
acquire numerous territories, of which probably the most important was
territory then known as Outer Manchuria but now constituting in many ways
the core of the current Russian Far East. I wonder if China someday will
make a grab for what was previously theirs:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Soviet_border_conflict

http://hir.harvard.edu/will-china-colonize-and-incorporate-siberia/

https://www.wilsoncenter.org/sites/default/files/No3_ChineseMigtoRussia.pdf

http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2016/04/12/why-chinas-latest-power-play-may-roil-russia/

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2015/06/21/world-view-russia-makes-a-controversial-deal-to-lease-siberia-land-to-china/
Oleg Smirnov
2017-07-13 00:22:15 UTC
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"tim..." wrote in message
Post by tim...
perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany
and Western Ukraine should be returned to Poland
instead, as just one example
I wonder how the Russkies would feel about Germany
demanding Königsberg (Kaliningrad) back?
It would be fair to return North America to the indigenous Americans and
resettle the invaders back to Europe (and the people of African origin back
to Africa etc).

The process of restoration of justice might be started from Hawaii.

Hawaii is under illegal US occupation for about a century, - in the 1890s
there was an anti-constitutional 'regime change' implemented by the American
agents and backed by the US army, after which Hawaii was illegally annexed.
jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
2017-07-13 13:14:28 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
"tim..." wrote in message
Post by tim...
perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany
and Western Ukraine should be returned to Poland
instead, as just one example
I wonder how the Russkies would feel about Germany
demanding Königsberg (Kaliningrad) back?
It would be fair to return North America to the indigenous Americans and
resettle the invaders back to Europe (and the people of African origin back
to Africa etc).
And all the jews back to the Middle East, insh'Allah!
- -
"We CAN hide forever."
- Klaun Shittinb'ricks (1940 - ), acknowledging that he will
NEVER prove where he infests or give his real jew name

"Die Juden sind unser Unglück!"
- Heinrich von Treitschke (1834 - 1896)

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out
because I was not a Socialist. Then they came for the Trade
Unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a Trade
Unionist. Then they came for the jews, and I did not speak out
because I did not give a shit. Then they came for me and there
wasn't a single commie bastard left to speak for me."
- Martin Niemöller (1892 - 1984)
The Peeler
2017-07-13 15:08:15 UTC
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On Thu, 13 Jul 2017 06:14:28 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass
of herself as "jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry'
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
Post by Oleg Smirnov
It would be fair to return North America to the indigenous Americans and
resettle the invaders back to Europe (and the people of African origin back
to Africa etc).
And all the jews back to the Middle East, insh'Allah!
YOU back in the loony bin again, dumb anal Razovic!
--
P-Dub to G. Razovic, the serb sexual cripple:
"You are a nothing. You have no skills. You have no job. You have no
woman. You can't have sex."
MID: <h6W8t.368009$***@newsfe03.iad>
Dennis
2017-08-09 06:09:18 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by Byker
Post by tim...
perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany
and Western Ukraine should be returned to Poland
instead, as just one example
I wonder how the Russkies would feel about Germany
demanding Königsberg (Kaliningrad) back?
It would be fair to return North America to the indigenous Americans
and resettle the invaders back to Europe (and the people of African
origin back to Africa etc).
The process of restoration of justice might be started from Hawaii.
Hawaii is under illegal US occupation for about a century, - in the
1890s there was an anti-constitutional 'regime change' implemented by
the American agents and backed by the US army, after which Hawaii was
illegally annexed.
Read the history of the Balkans and the Net posts of their present-day
denizens. Every present-day country in the Balkans remembers the time over
7 centuries ago when it was the king of the hill before the Turks or the
Hapsburgs took over, and wants to that status quo ante.

Those who cannot remember their past are doomed to repeat it, perhaps, but
there are those who cause themselves untold misery because they cannot let
go of their past..

Dennis
Oleg Smirnov
2017-08-10 07:01:09 UTC
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Post by Dennis
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by Byker
Post by tim...
perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany
and Western Ukraine should be returned to Poland
instead, as just one example
I wonder how the Russkies would feel about Germany
demanding Königsberg (Kaliningrad) back?
It would be fair to return North America to the
indigenous Americans and resettle the invaders back to
Europe (and the people of African origin back to Africa
etc).
The process of restoration of justice might be started
from Hawaii.
Hawaii is under illegal US occupation for about a
century, - in the 1890s there was an anti-constitutional
'regime change' implemented by the American agents and
backed by the US army, after which Hawaii was illegally
annexed.
Read the history of the Balkans and the Net posts of
their present-day denizens. Every present-day country in
the Balkans remembers the time over 7 centuries ago when
it was the king of the hill before the Turks or the
Hapsburgs took over, and wants to that status quo ante.
Those who cannot remember their past are doomed to repeat
it, perhaps, but there are those who cause themselves
untold misery because they cannot let go of their past..
Are you German?

Try to teach 'Byker' something.

MM
2017-07-13 09:13:22 UTC
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Post by tim...
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
it's how all land was acquired in the middle ages and early modern periods
it is no different to anywhere else that current countries formed before
1945 claim as their own
perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany and Western Ukraine
should be returned to Poland
Perhaps the Ukraine should get Crimea back?

MM

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R. Mark Clayton
2017-07-13 11:30:56 UTC
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Post by MM
Post by tim...
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
it's how all land was acquired in the middle ages and early modern periods
it is no different to anywhere else that current countries formed before
1945 claim as their own
perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany and Western Ukraine
should be returned to Poland
Perhaps the Ukraine should get Crimea back?
It was long part of Russia. Kruschov, who organised defended it during WWII, erroneously made it part of Ukrainian SSR in the 1950's, but basically nearly all the people who live there are Russian.
Post by MM
MM
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Jethro_uk
2017-07-14 16:16:46 UTC
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Post by R. Mark Clayton
Post by MM
Post by tim...
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
it's how all land was acquired in the middle ages and early modern periods
it is no different to anywhere else that current countries formed
before 1945 claim as their own
perhaps Poland should give Silesia [1] back to Germany and Western
Ukraine should be returned to Poland
Perhaps the Ukraine should get Crimea back?
It was long part of Russia. Kruschov, who organised defended it during
WWII, erroneously made it part of Ukrainian SSR in the 1950's, but
basically nearly all the people who live there are Russian.
Post by MM
MM
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I recently read a fascinating book "prisoners of geography" which
explained how the political world we live in is really a product of the
physical world it's imposed on.

Three standout issues were:

1) Russias concerns about the Ukraine are entirely understandable, given
the fact it is invariably the preferred route to invade Russia

2) Africa is doomed to poverty by dint of having no rivers that allow
easy navigation around the continent

3) The USA won the lottery in life for exactly the opposite reason:
Enormous natural resources with a river system that might have been
purpose built for moving them across the continent ....
Norman Wells
2017-07-14 18:46:57 UTC
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Post by Jethro_uk
I recently read a fascinating book "prisoners of geography" which
explained how the political world we live in is really a product of the
physical world it's imposed on.
1) Russias concerns about the Ukraine are entirely understandable, given
the fact it is invariably the preferred route to invade Russia
Does that mean we'd be justified in taking over France?
Post by Jethro_uk
2) Africa is doomed to poverty by dint of having no rivers that allow
easy navigation around the continent
Yes. Apart of course from the Nile, which is the longest in the world,
the Zambesi, the Congo, the Niger, the Limpopo etc etc etc.
Post by Jethro_uk
Enormous natural resources with a river system that might have been
purpose built for moving them across the continent ....
Which is why they had to build all those railways presumably.
Jethro_uk
2017-07-15 13:50:35 UTC
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Post by Norman Wells
Post by Jethro_uk
I recently read a fascinating book "prisoners of geography" which
explained how the political world we live in is really a product of the
physical world it's imposed on.
1) Russias concerns about the Ukraine are entirely understandable,
given the fact it is invariably the preferred route to invade Russia
Does that mean we'd be justified in taking over France?
We spent centuries trying :)
Post by Norman Wells
Post by Jethro_uk
2) Africa is doomed to poverty by dint of having no rivers that allow
easy navigation around the continent
Yes. Apart of course from the Nile, which is the longest in the world,
the Zambesi, the Congo, the Niger, the Limpopo etc etc etc.
Must be the intelligent Norms day off ... I wrote a complete sentence,
you just responded to the initial half ... *you* try and sail around
Africa by boat. When you realise it can't be done because of massive
waterfalls and disconnects in the land, you'll understand why Africa -
despite being resource rich, is export poor.
Post by Norman Wells
Post by Jethro_uk
Enormous natural resources with a river system that might have been
purpose built for moving them across the continent ....
Which is why they had to build all those railways presumably.
Which stopped at major river ports all around the USA.

I gave you the title of the book, why don't you piss off, read it, and
then criticise *it* rather than my (admittedly rushed) precis. The author
is Tim Marshall, so take it up with him.
Fredxxx
2017-07-13 00:57:59 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?

Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila? Or
doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?

Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
Incubus
2017-07-13 08:13:38 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Fredxxx
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?
Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila? Or
doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?
Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
He's just a troll who writes frivolous posts knowing that a group of
people will write predictable replies. Stop dancing for him.
Bod
2017-07-13 08:20:23 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Incubus
Post by Fredxxx
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?
Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila?
Or doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?
Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
He's just a troll who writes frivolous posts knowing that a group of
people will write predictable replies. Stop dancing for him.
Is it true that MM is a love child of Juncker?
abelard
2017-07-13 09:08:17 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bod
Post by Incubus
Post by Fredxxx
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?
Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila?
Or doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?
Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
He's just a troll who writes frivolous posts knowing that a group of
people will write predictable replies. Stop dancing for him.
Is it true that MM is a love child of Juncker?
a hate child
Drusilla Mitchell
2017-07-13 10:23:57 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Incubus
Post by Fredxxx
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?
Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila?
Or doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?
Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
He's just a troll who writes frivolous posts knowing that a group of
people will write predictable replies. Stop dancing for him.
Is it true that MM is a love child of Juncker?

No Megele.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-07-14 22:54:53 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bod
Post by Incubus
Post by Fredxxx
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?
Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila?
Or doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?
Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
He's just a troll who writes frivolous posts knowing that a group of
people will write predictable replies. Stop dancing for him.
Is it true that MM is a love child of Juncker?
MM got something wrong above: "everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today". Funny how almost everyone accepted it then. "Wrong" is an opinion and nothing more. I for one would love the slave trade to come back. Hands up who wouldn't want someone to do everything for you for free? Those Muslims have got to be useful for something.
--
What is the difference between a female jogger and a sewing machine?
A sewing machine only has one bobbin.
The Peeler
2017-07-14 23:07:28 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 23:54:53 +0100, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Bod
Is it true that MM is a love child of Juncker?
MM got something wrong above: "everyone knows it was wrong then and is
wrong today". Funny how almost everyone accepted it then. "Wrong" is an
opinion and nothing more. I for one would love the slave trade to come
back. Hands up who wouldn't want someone to do everything for you for
free? Those Muslims have got to be useful for something.
Can't you do ANYTHING but reveal what a congenital idiot you are, Birdbrain?
LOL
--
ItsJoanNotJoann addressing Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"You're an annoying troll and I'm done with you and your
stupidity."
MID: <e39a6a7f-9677-4e78-a866-***@googlegroups.com>
MM
2017-07-13 09:16:15 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Fredxxx
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?
Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila? Or
doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?
Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
No. I don't support referendums, period. Attlee once said, and he was
right: "Referendums were a device of dictators and demagogues."

MM

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com
Pelican
2017-07-13 09:51:05 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by MM
Post by Fredxxx
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?
Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila? Or
doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?
Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
No. I don't support referendums, period. Attlee once said, and he was
right: "Referendums were a device of dictators and demagogues."
Only if you are on the losing sided. Referendums are just another form
of vote. Those advocating a particular outcome have a responsibility to
argue the case - democracy imposes some disciplines on its adherents.
Bod
2017-07-13 11:39:26 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by MM
Post by Fredxxx
Post by MM
Britain once had a thriving business in the slave trade, but now
everyone knows it was wrong then and is wrong today.
Britain captured, i.e. stole, Gibraltar by force in 1704, so wasn't
that an illegal act of war? I'm not surprised that Spain wants it
back.
If you hate the British so much and what the UK stands for, why do you
stay? Apart from getting free NHS treatment?
Why don't you whinge about the Canary islands, or Ceuta, or Mellila? Or
doesn't that suit your anti-UK stance?
Do you support the referendum on the 1st October?
No. I don't support referendums, period. Attlee once said, and he was
right: "Referendums were a device of dictators and demagogues."
MM
---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com
How can giving the people a referendum choice be dictating?
Norman Wells
2017-07-13 13:42:39 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bod
Post by MM
No. I don't support referendums, period. Attlee once said, and he was
right: "Referendums were a device of dictators and demagogues."
How can giving the people a referendum choice be dictating?
Because they give the people a say, and that in MM's eyes, is a denial
of democracy, especially as the results always seem to go against him.
pensive hamster
2017-07-13 15:10:36 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
[...]
Post by Bod
Post by MM
No. I don't support referendums, period. Attlee once said, and he was
right: "Referendums were a device of dictators and demagogues."
How can giving the people a referendum choice be dictating?
Because a referendum "choice" tends to over-simplify complex
questions, because a referendum result is usually a one-time
event and thus difficult to reverse (unlike normal elections), and
because a referendum gives demagogues (of various persuasions)
the opportunity to spin the facts and con the voters. Eg.:

https://fullfact.org/news/what-proportion-uk-law-comes-brussels/

"50 per cent of all our economic laws come from Europe."
Bill Cash MP (Conservative), House of Commons, 24 October 2011.

"EU legislation...accounts for around half of all new regulation."
Chuka Umunna MP, Labour Party press release, 25 October 2011.

"Only 7 per cent of primary legislation comes from the EU."
Polly Toynbee, The Guardian, 24 October 2011.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-07-14 22:56:05 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by Bod
Post by MM
No. I don't support referendums, period. Attlee once said, and he was
right: "Referendums were a device of dictators and demagogues."
How can giving the people a referendum choice be dictating?
Because a referendum "choice" tends to over-simplify complex
questions, because a referendum result is usually a one-time
event and thus difficult to reverse (unlike normal elections), and
because a referendum gives demagogues (of various persuasions)
https://fullfact.org/news/what-proportion-uk-law-comes-brussels/
"50 per cent of all our economic laws come from Europe."
Bill Cash MP (Conservative), House of Commons, 24 October 2011.
"EU legislation...accounts for around half of all new regulation."
Chuka Umunna MP, Labour Party press release, 25 October 2011.
"Only 7 per cent of primary legislation comes from the EU."
Polly Toynbee, The Guardian, 24 October 2011.
Doesn't matter. Everyone is free to do their own research and come to the choice that they desire. If they want to believe what they've read or seen on the telly, then that's their choice.
--
My wife was hinting about what she wanted for our upcoming anniversary.
She said, "I want something shiny that goes from 0 to 150 in about 3 seconds"
I bought her a bathroom scale.
And then the fight started......
The Peeler
2017-07-14 23:09:36 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 23:56:05 +0100, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Doesn't matter.
YOU don't matter, Birdbrain! Ask your dad, your sister and your mom! They
will confirm it!
--
More details from Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) sociopathic
"mind":
"If I wanted you to stab me with a knife and kill me, you should not
get into trouble for it".
"I would kill my sister if I thought I'd get away with it".
"I'm not what most people think of as human".
(Courtesy of Mr Pounder)
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