Discussion:
For The Many - Not The Jew
(too old to reply)
pamela
2018-05-04 17:58:03 UTC
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council


--
jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
2018-05-04 20:18:45 UTC
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Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Are they STILL kvetching about 'anti-semitism'®™?

'Israeel' is thataway ------------------------------>

--

"You are full of shit. You'll never convince any of us real Jews that
there is no Jewish look. I know my people and I can see their
Jewishness. Susan is not a Jew. If you want to get down her panties
just ask her she'll let you. She's a non-Jew."
Message-ID: <bfbdb526-1042-4e8e-a39f-***@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>

"You can try all you want and get all the plastic surgery you want but
you'll never look like one of us because you are not a Jew. You are
an Irish Shiksa that Isn't even a righteous non-Jew a Ger Tzadeck You
are VEEDMUS amongst us and are a gentile. I would not be surprised if
you ever go to Eretz Israel and spout off your non-senseical lies that
a Jew doesn't kill you or a gentile murder you. You are wicked because
you antagonize and lie about the Tzadeckim. The best place for you is
scrubbing toilets and urinals in a gymnasium that is predominate used
by Negros."
Message-ID: <ee17d097-89f7-4e72-a41a-***@p2g2000prn.googlegroups.com>

- drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish, mocking neo-jew Suzy KKKohen's
attempted 'conversion' to the jew race

"Warren is not well. He's a non-Jewish mental patient who usually declines to
take his medications. Please keep this in mind when viewing future posts."
Message-ID: <JZQTk.1726$***@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>

- neo-jew 'convert' Suzy KKKohen, mocking drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish's
claim to be a jew
The Peeler
2018-05-04 22:34:25 UTC
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On Fri, 04 May 2018 13:18:45 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass
of herself as "jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry'
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Are they STILL kvetching about 'anti-semitism'®™?
'Israeel' is thataway ------------------------------>
Your head--->your arse
--
Gray Guest about inferior Razovic: "You are a subhuman. You should not be
permitted to propagate your genes."
MID: <***@88.198.244.100>
NEMO
2018-05-05 11:16:27 UTC
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A shiteating cowardly nazoid sub-louse PEDO named Andrew "Andrzej"
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
'Israeel' is thataway ------------------------------>
And the Mossad bullet is thataway <---------------------

LOL, Andrzej!
GB
2018-05-04 20:32:06 UTC
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Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?

Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling. I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
2018-05-04 21:25:14 UTC
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On Fri, 4 May 2018 21:32:06 +0100, jewboi GB (jb)
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling. I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
What are you kvetching about NOW jewboi? 'Anti-semitism'®™ is a
perfectly rational reaction to jew behaviour.
--

"You are full of shit. You'll never convince any of us real Jews that
there is no Jewish look. I know my people and I can see their
Jewishness. Susan is not a Jew. If you want to get down her panties
just ask her she'll let you. She's a non-Jew."
Message-ID: <bfbdb526-1042-4e8e-a39f-***@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>

"You can try all you want and get all the plastic surgery you want but
you'll never look like one of us because you are not a Jew. You are
an Irish Shiksa that Isn't even a righteous non-Jew a Ger Tzadeck You
are VEEDMUS amongst us and are a gentile. I would not be surprised if
you ever go to Eretz Israel and spout off your non-senseical lies that
a Jew doesn't kill you or a gentile murder you. You are wicked because
you antagonize and lie about the Tzadeckim. The best place for you is
scrubbing toilets and urinals in a gymnasium that is predominate used
by Negros."
Message-ID: <ee17d097-89f7-4e72-a41a-***@p2g2000prn.googlegroups.com>

- drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish, mocking neo-jew Suzy KKKohen's
attempted 'conversion' to the jew race

"Warren is not well. He's a non-Jewish mental patient who usually declines to
take his medications. Please keep this in mind when viewing future posts."
Message-ID: <JZQTk.1726$***@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>

- neo-jew 'convert' Suzy KKKohen, mocking drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish's
claim to be a jew
The Peeler
2018-05-04 22:35:27 UTC
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Raw Message
On Fri, 04 May 2018 14:25:14 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass
of herself as "jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry'
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling. I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
What are you kvetching about NOW jewboi? 'Anti-semitism'®™ is a
perfectly rational reaction to jew behaviour.
The loony bin is thataway, psychopath -------------------->
--
Retarded, anal, subnormal and extremely proud of it: our resident
psychopath, dumb serbian bitch G. Razovic (aka "The Rectum").
JNugent
2018-05-04 22:19:37 UTC
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Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't agree.

Livingstone *does* hate Jews.

This is because he sees them as part of the bourgoisie and is
envious/censorious of their intellectual and material success.
Fredxx
2018-05-05 08:57:07 UTC
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Post by JNugent
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't agree.
Livingstone *does* hate Jews.
I don't see any evidence of his hate, just demonstrating that hypocrisy
and sensitivity to historical facts are taboo subjects when it comes to
jews.
Ian Jackson
2018-05-05 09:16:35 UTC
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In message <pcjrl7$nlq$***@dont-email.me>, Fredxx <***@nospam.com>
writes
Post by Fredxx
Post by JNugent
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-c
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process
has continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and
haven't voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't agree.
Livingstone *does* hate Jews.
I don't see any evidence of his hate, just demonstrating that hypocrisy
and sensitivity to historical facts are taboo subjects when it comes to
jews.
IIRC, Livingstone made the mistake of saying something like Hitler was
initially tolerant of Jews. However, he didn't want them in Germany, and
wanted them all to leave and go to a homeland in Palestine - ie he was
effectively a Zionist. Some people interpreted this as "Hitler was
actually quite a nice chap, and people have been rather harsh about what
he did".
--
Ian
Fredxx
2018-05-05 10:32:21 UTC
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Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Fredxx
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-c
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process
has  continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and
haven't  voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
 I don't agree.
 Livingstone *does* hate Jews.
I don't see any evidence of his hate, just demonstrating that
hypocrisy and sensitivity to historical facts are taboo subjects when
it comes to jews.
IIRC, Livingstone made the mistake of saying something like Hitler was
initially tolerant of Jews.
In the past I have read up about this, and there is evidence to suggest
his hatred for Jews emerged after WW1. From:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler

Historian Richard J. Evans states that "historians now generally agree
that his notorious, murderous anti-Semitism emerged well after Germany's
defeat [in World War I], as a product of the paranoid "stab-in-the-back"
explanation for the catastrophe".[57]
Post by Ian Jackson
However, he didn't want them in Germany, and
wanted them all to leave and go to a homeland in Palestine - ie he was
effectively a Zionist. Some people interpreted this as "Hitler was
actually quite a nice chap, and people have been rather harsh about what
he did".
So does that make you an antisemite for agreeing with Livingstone that
Hitler supported Zion? Should you be barred from the Labour party?

I don't recall Livingstone ever saying Hitler was a 'nice chap' if
anything he called him mad.
jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
2018-05-05 13:46:01 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by JNugent
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't agree.
Livingstone *does* hate Jews.
And so he should. Everyone else does.
Post by JNugent
This is because he sees them as part of the bourgoisie and is
envious/censorious of their intellectual and material success.
No, it because of their behaviour...the *universal* cause of
'anti-semitism'®™.

"Any subpeople that have been persecuted for two thousand years must
be doing something wrong."
- Heinz 'Henry' Albert Kissinger (1923 - )
--

"You are full of shit. You'll never convince any of us real Jews that
there is no Jewish look. I know my people and I can see their
Jewishness. Susan is not a Jew. If you want to get down her panties
just ask her she'll let you. She's a non-Jew."
Message-ID: <bfbdb526-1042-4e8e-a39f-***@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>

"You can try all you want and get all the plastic surgery you want but
you'll never look like one of us because you are not a Jew. You are
an Irish Shiksa that Isn't even a righteous non-Jew a Ger Tzadeck You
are VEEDMUS amongst us and are a gentile. I would not be surprised if
you ever go to Eretz Israel and spout off your non-senseical lies that
a Jew doesn't kill you or a gentile murder you. You are wicked because
you antagonize and lie about the Tzadeckim. The best place for you is
scrubbing toilets and urinals in a gymnasium that is predominate used
by Negros."
Message-ID: <ee17d097-89f7-4e72-a41a-***@p2g2000prn.googlegroups.com>

- drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish, mocking neo-jew Suzy KKKohen's
attempted 'conversion' to the jew race

"Warren is not well. He's a non-Jewish mental patient who usually declines to
take his medications. Please keep this in mind when viewing future posts."
Message-ID: <JZQTk.1726$***@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>

- neo-jew 'convert' Suzy KKKohen, mocking drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish's
claim to be a jew
NEMO
2018-05-05 14:01:18 UTC
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"You may have something there. This touchy-feely 'New Man' attitude
isn't getting me anywhere. Perhaps I should go for the more basic
Neanderthal approach."

-Posted by the main nazoid sub-louse, filthy pervert Andrzej, Baron of
pedos (get it, folks? "Andrzej, Baron"?),
Message-ID: <***@news.ukgateway.net>#1/1.

LOL!
The Peeler
2018-05-05 18:06:00 UTC
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On Sat, 05 May 2018 06:46:01 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass
of herself as "jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry'
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
Post by JNugent
I don't agree.
Livingstone *does* hate Jews.
And so he should. Everyone else does.
Obviously NOT, or you wouldn't need to SCREECH like insane on Usenet because
of "the Jews", year after year, decade after decade!
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
Post by JNugent
This is because he sees them as part of the bourgoisie and is
envious/censorious of their intellectual and material success.
No, it because of their behaviour...the *universal* cause of
'anti-semitism'®™.
"Any subpeople that have been persecuted for two thousand years must
be doing something wrong."
- Heinz 'Henry' Albert Kissinger (1923 - )
Anti-Semitism, ALWAYS, without ANY exception, was and is the resort of
mental, emotional and sexual cripples who can't cope in an intelligent
manner with their own personal shortcomings and handicaps. You are the
prototype of such a miserable individual, you mentally, emotionally and
sexually crippled housebound loser!
--
Gray Guest about inferior Razovic: "You are a subhuman. You should not be
permitted to propagate your genes."
MID: <***@88.198.244.100>
Judith
2018-05-08 23:04:57 UTC
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Post by JNugent
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't agree.
Livingstone *does* hate Jews.
I'm sure you will have evidence of this: please feel free to share it with us.


(PS A hate of the state of Israel - is not a hate of Jews)
Handsome Jack
2018-05-05 07:47:40 UTC
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Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling. I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
The Conservative party, which conspired with the Labour party's Blairite
faction and the right-wing press to invent this anti-semitism smear
campaign. It is a deliberate attempt to weaken the Labour party machine
and thereby undermine Corbyn's leadership.
--
Jack
harry
2018-05-05 08:04:47 UTC
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Post by Handsome Jack
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling. I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
The Conservative party, which conspired with the Labour party's Blairite
faction and the right-wing press to invent this anti-semitism smear
campaign. It is a deliberate attempt to weaken the Labour party machine
and thereby undermine Corbyn's leadership.
Corbyn is big mates with various muslim terrorist organisations. No smear needed.
Fredxx
2018-05-05 08:59:04 UTC
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Post by harry
Post by Handsome Jack
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling. I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
The Conservative party, which conspired with the Labour party's Blairite
faction and the right-wing press to invent this anti-semitism smear
campaign. It is a deliberate attempt to weaken the Labour party machine
and thereby undermine Corbyn's leadership.
Corbyn is big mates with various muslim terrorist organisations. No smear needed.
He's also appeasing those who support a state born out of terrorism.

I would say in an even handed manner. What it does show is the clout of
one religious group over another.
GB
2018-05-05 15:25:28 UTC
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Post by Fredxx
What it does show is the clout of
one religious group over another.
Surely, all the election result shows is that you can't piss off a chunk
of the electorate and expect them to vote for you?
JNugent
2018-05-05 15:34:39 UTC
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Post by GB
What it does show is the clout of one religious group over another.
Surely, all the election result shows is that you can't piss off a chunk
of the electorate and expect them to vote for you?
1993 certainly proved that with the county elections. Major's government
had announced the imposition of VAT on domestic fuel - a whole YEAR in
advance!

Older voters were never going to support that, even though it was an EU
diktat.
Fredxx
2018-05-05 16:00:32 UTC
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Post by GB
What it does show is the clout of one religious group over another.
Surely, all the election result shows is that you can't piss off a chunk
of the electorate and expect them to vote for you?
I don't believe he did anything of the sort. The media created a
mountain over nothing.

Shit sticks, even if its not yours or of your own making.

While I detest JC, I feel the Labour party has been smeared by
interested groups, where JC, whatever he says or does, will still
attract antisemetic comments.
GB
2018-05-05 16:07:35 UTC
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Post by Fredxx
While I detest JC, I feel the Labour party has been smeared by
interested groups, where JC, whatever he says or does, will still
attract antisemetic comments.
To some extent, Corbyn is acting foolishly in naive ways. For example,
he found out the hard way that his facebook account was giving him
grief, so he closed it. But he left open his twitter account. The Sunday
Times then did a big spread on the awful things written on some of the
(many) twitter accounts that Corbyn follows.

He clearly needs a minder.
The Todal
2018-05-08 16:12:32 UTC
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Post by GB
Post by Fredxx
While I detest JC, I feel the Labour party has been smeared by
interested groups, where JC, whatever he says or does, will still
attract antisemetic comments.
To some extent, Corbyn is acting foolishly in naive ways. For example,
he found out the hard way that his facebook account was giving him
grief, so he closed it. But he left open his twitter account. The Sunday
Times then did a big spread on the awful things written on some of the
(many) twitter accounts that Corbyn follows.
He clearly needs a minder.
I don't suppose Theresa May has a Facebook account or a Twitter account.
If she does, it will be run by a social media team who decide what
Theresa's thoughts should be.

Donald Trump is the ultimate example of a man who sounds off on social
media and doesn't give a shit what people think of him. And it doesn't
lose him any votes.

Corbyn presumably wanted to have a way of communicating with "the
people" but didn't want to be bothered with monitoring all the
sociopaths who contributed to groups he happened to have joined ages ago.

It's ridiculous to blame Corbyn for the remarks made by other people.
But our Press doesn't care about truth or fairness - any opportunity to
slag off Corbyn is gratefully exploited.
GB
2018-05-08 17:24:30 UTC
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Post by The Todal
Corbyn presumably wanted to have a way of communicating with "the
people" but didn't want to be bothered with monitoring all the
sociopaths who contributed to groups he happened to have joined ages ago.
He would have been well-advised to leave those groups. He can't possibly
have time now to follow them all anyway.
Post by The Todal
It's ridiculous to blame Corbyn for the remarks made by other people.
But our Press doesn't care about truth or fairness - any opportunity to
slag off Corbyn is gratefully exploited.
Whilst of course you are right, Corbyn's either very naive or very
arrogant for giving the press the opportunity.
R. Mark Clayton
2018-05-08 17:57:39 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Corbyn presumably wanted to have a way of communicating with "the
people" but didn't want to be bothered with monitoring all the
sociopaths who contributed to groups he happened to have joined ages ago.
He would have been well-advised to leave those groups. He can't possibly
have time now to follow them all anyway.
Post by The Todal
It's ridiculous to blame Corbyn for the remarks made by other people.
But our Press doesn't care about truth or fairness - any opportunity to
slag off Corbyn is gratefully exploited.
Whilst of course you are right, Corbyn's either very naive or very
arrogant for giving the press the opportunity.
or he agrees with their fanatical position - are those pictures of him with IRA members at their fund raisers, Hamas and Hezbollah etc. fakes?
The Todal
2018-05-08 23:18:49 UTC
Permalink
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Post by R. Mark Clayton
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Corbyn presumably wanted to have a way of communicating with "the
people" but didn't want to be bothered with monitoring all the
sociopaths who contributed to groups he happened to have joined ages ago.
He would have been well-advised to leave those groups. He can't possibly
have time now to follow them all anyway.
Post by The Todal
It's ridiculous to blame Corbyn for the remarks made by other people.
But our Press doesn't care about truth or fairness - any opportunity to
slag off Corbyn is gratefully exploited.
Whilst of course you are right, Corbyn's either very naive or very
arrogant for giving the press the opportunity.
or he agrees with their fanatical position - are those pictures of him with IRA members at their fund raisers, Hamas and Hezbollah etc. fakes?
Well, if you can provide links to them, maybe we could debate that.
Snow_Flower
2018-05-11 20:37:40 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Corbyn presumably wanted to have a way of communicating with "the
people" but didn't want to be bothered with monitoring all the
sociopaths who contributed to groups he happened to have joined ages ago.
He would have been well-advised to leave those groups. He can't possibly
have time now to follow them all anyway.
Post by The Todal
It's ridiculous to blame Corbyn for the remarks made by other people.
But our Press doesn't care about truth or fairness - any opportunity to
slag off Corbyn is gratefully exploited.
Whilst of course you are right, Corbyn's either very naive or very
arrogant for giving the press the opportunity.
or he agrees with their fanatical position - are those pictures of him
with IRA members at their fund raisers, Hamas and Hezbollah etc. fakes?
Well, if you can provide links to them, maybe we could debate that.
Under Bliar - labour transmuted from labour to new labour
Under Corbyn - new labour has transmuted from new labour to new nazi

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Fredxx
2018-05-11 21:07:11 UTC
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Post by Snow_Flower
Post by The Todal
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Corbyn presumably wanted to have a way of communicating with "the
people" but didn't want to be bothered with monitoring all the
sociopaths who contributed to groups he happened to have joined ages ago.
He would have been well-advised to leave those groups. He can't possibly
have time now to follow them all anyway.
Post by The Todal
It's ridiculous to blame Corbyn for the remarks made by other people.
But our Press doesn't care about truth or fairness - any
opportunity to
slag off Corbyn is gratefully exploited.
Whilst of course you are right, Corbyn's either very naive or very
arrogant for giving the press the opportunity.
or he agrees with their fanatical position - are those pictures of
him with IRA members at their fund raisers, Hamas and Hezbollah etc.
fakes?
Well, if you can provide links to them, maybe we could debate that.
Under Bliar - labour transmuted from labour to new labour
Under Corbyn - new labour has transmuted from new labour to new nazi
You have just demonstrated how effective the right wing jewish lobby is.
R. Mark Clayton
2018-05-12 09:07:24 UTC
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Post by Snow_Flower
Post by The Todal
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Corbyn presumably wanted to have a way of communicating with "the
people" but didn't want to be bothered with monitoring all the
sociopaths who contributed to groups he happened to have joined ages ago.
He would have been well-advised to leave those groups. He can't possibly
have time now to follow them all anyway.
Post by The Todal
It's ridiculous to blame Corbyn for the remarks made by other people.
But our Press doesn't care about truth or fairness - any opportunity to
slag off Corbyn is gratefully exploited.
Whilst of course you are right, Corbyn's either very naive or very
arrogant for giving the press the opportunity.
or he agrees with their fanatical position - are those pictures of him
with IRA members at their fund raisers, Hamas and Hezbollah etc. fakes?
Well, if you can provide links to them, maybe we could debate that.
Under Bliar - labour transmuted from labour to new labour
Under Corbyn - new labour has transmuted from new labour to new nazi
Well national socialist - supporting Brexit and expropriation.
JNugent
2018-05-09 01:02:18 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by Fredxx
While I detest JC, I feel the Labour party has been smeared by
interested groups, where JC, whatever he says or does, will still
attract antisemetic comments.
To some extent, Corbyn is acting foolishly in naive ways. For example,
he found out the hard way that his facebook account was giving him
grief, so he closed it. But he left open his twitter account. The
Sunday Times then did a big spread on the awful things written on some
of the (many) twitter accounts that Corbyn follows.
He clearly needs a minder.
I don't suppose Theresa May has a Facebook account or a Twitter account.
If she does, it will be run by a social media team who decide what
Theresa's thoughts should be.
Donald Trump is the ultimate example of a man who sounds off on social
media and doesn't give a shit what people think of him. And it doesn't
lose him any votes.
Corbyn presumably wanted to have a way of communicating with "the
people" but didn't want to be bothered with monitoring all the
sociopaths who contributed to groups he happened to have joined ages ago.
It's ridiculous to blame Corbyn for the remarks made by other people.
But... when a Conservative politician is linked in any tenuous and
tortuous way at all with any other entity (having chilren at the same
judo class would do), the loony left press jumps on that as though you
couldn't possibly ask for more evidence of association and even connivance.

Why should Corbyn be exempt from that?
Post by The Todal
But our Press doesn't care about truth or fairness - any opportunity to
slag off Corbyn is gratefully exploited.
Thinking of the Guardian... Oh, the irony...
Judith
2018-05-08 23:06:45 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by harry
Post by Handsome Jack
Post by GB
Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling. I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
The Conservative party, which conspired with the Labour party's Blairite
faction and the right-wing press to invent this anti-semitism smear
campaign. It is a deliberate attempt to weaken the Labour party machine
and thereby undermine Corbyn's leadership.
Corbyn is big mates with various muslim terrorist organisations. No smear needed.
And so - that means he hates Jews - rather than just hates the state of Israel
does it?
Sam Clark
2018-05-05 12:26:05 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.

Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.

So far the major candidates accused in the antisemitism row are:

Tony Greenstein,
Jackie Walker,
Moshé Machov,
Miko Peled,
Ken Loach,
Christine Shawcroft,
Alan Bull,
Mark Wadsworth.

Which accusations do you support and can you explain why? or do you have
your own example of Labour antisemitism.
JNugent
2018-05-05 13:50:41 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.
Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.
Tony Greenstein,
Jackie Walker,
Moshé Machov,
Miko Peled,
Ken Loach,
Christine Shawcroft,
Alan Bull,
Mark Wadsworth.
Which accusations do you support and can you explain why? or do you have
your own example of Labour antisemitism.
Wadsworth has already been expelled, hasn't he?
GB
2018-05-05 15:32:56 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.
Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.
I don't have any strong views about how the Labour Party governs its
membership. I was just making the very straightforward point that merely
being tactless is enough to piss off members of the electorate. If
Labour had avoided that, they might currently hold Barnet Council.
jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
2018-05-05 16:24:09 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sat, 5 May 2018 16:32:56 +0100, jewboi GB (jb)
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.
Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.
I don't have any strong views about how the Labour Party governs its
membership. I was just making the very straightforward point that merely
being tactless is enough to piss off members of the electorate. If
Labour had avoided that, they might currently hold Barnet Council.
Given your left-wing/bolshevik/commie/socialist heritage, I would have
thought MOST of you jew bastards would vote Labour!

shabbat shalom a"h!

gut shabbos!
--

"You are full of shit. You'll never convince any of us real Jews that
there is no Jewish look. I know my people and I can see their
Jewishness. Susan is not a Jew. If you want to get down her panties
just ask her she'll let you. She's a non-Jew."
Message-ID: <bfbdb526-1042-4e8e-a39f-***@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>

"You can try all you want and get all the plastic surgery you want but
you'll never look like one of us because you are not a Jew. You are
an Irish Shiksa that Isn't even a righteous non-Jew a Ger Tzadeck You
are VEEDMUS amongst us and are a gentile. I would not be surprised if
you ever go to Eretz Israel and spout off your non-senseical lies that
a Jew doesn't kill you or a gentile murder you. You are wicked because
you antagonize and lie about the Tzadeckim. The best place for you is
scrubbing toilets and urinals in a gymnasium that is predominate used
by Negros."
Message-ID: <ee17d097-89f7-4e72-a41a-***@p2g2000prn.googlegroups.com>

- drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish, mocking neo-jew Suzy KKKohen's
attempted 'conversion' to the jew race

"Warren is not well. He's a non-Jewish mental patient who usually declines to
take his medications. Please keep this in mind when viewing future posts."
Message-ID: <JZQTk.1726$***@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>

- neo-jew 'convert' Suzy KKKohen, mocking drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish's
claim to be a jew
The Peeler
2018-05-05 18:32:45 UTC
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Raw Message
On Sat, 05 May 2018 09:24:09 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass
of herself as "jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry'
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
Post by GB
I don't have any strong views about how the Labour Party governs its
membership. I was just making the very straightforward point that merely
being tactless is enough to piss off members of the electorate. If
Labour had avoided that, they might currently hold Barnet Council.
Given your left-wing/bolshevik/commie/socialist heritage, I would have
thought MOST of you jew bastards would vote Labour!
<BG> Poor psychotic idiot!
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
shabbat shalom a"h!
gut shabbos!
<BG> Poor psychotic idiot!
--
Retarded, anal, subnormal and extremely proud of it: our resident
psychopath, dumb serbian bitch G. Razovic (aka "The Rectum").
NEMO
2018-05-05 22:58:20 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On the one hand... so many Jewish geniuses:

"Nobel Prizes have been awarded to 892 individuals, of whom 201 were Jewish descent,
or 22.5%, although Jews comprise less than 0.2% of the world's population."

On the other hand... old pedo Andrew "Andrzej" Baron, a pathetic sub-louse, who made
a "living" peddling pirated, defective software in London.

How's that blood pressure now, old pedo Andrzej? LOL!!
The Todal
2018-05-08 16:25:55 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process
has continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and
haven't voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.
Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.
I don't have any strong views about how the Labour Party governs its
membership. I was just making the very straightforward point that merely
being tactless is enough to piss off members of the electorate. If
Labour had avoided that, they might currently hold Barnet Council.
Labour has never held Barnet Council in its history.

A massive swing to Labour was never very likely there. But is it really
true that anyone was daft enough to vote Tory because they hated Ken
Livingstone? In their fuddled brains, did they see him as a powerful
figure in the Shadow Cabinet and a potential future leader of the Labour
Party? Are such people fit to cast a vote at all?

Even Gorgeous George Galloway has now said that it's time for Ken to bow
out of politics.
GB
2018-05-08 17:34:43 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process
has continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and
haven't voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.
Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.
I don't have any strong views about how the Labour Party governs its
membership. I was just making the very straightforward point that
merely being tactless is enough to piss off members of the electorate.
If Labour had avoided that, they might currently hold Barnet Council.
Labour has never held Barnet Council in its history.
The papers were all talking about it swinging over to Labour, along with
(I think) Southwark.
Post by The Todal
A massive swing to Labour was never very likely there. But is it really
true that anyone was daft enough to vote Tory because they hated Ken
Livingstone? In their fuddled brains, did they see him as a powerful
figure in the Shadow Cabinet and a potential future leader of the Labour
Party? Are such people fit to cast a vote at all?
I don't think anyone takes any notice of Ken, but the Jewish Labour
insiders complaining about being treated badly were a problem. Corbyn's
perceived failure to do anything about it didn't help. Corbyn's
attending a very odd Jewish gathering didn't endear him to more
traditional Jews. The criticism of Israel, rather than specific policies
of the right wing government, was a problem. Add it all together, and
there was a protest vote. It's only 1% of the electorate, so Labour can
afford to live with that.
R. Mark Clayton
2018-05-08 18:02:42 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process
has continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and
haven't voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.
Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.
I don't have any strong views about how the Labour Party governs its
membership. I was just making the very straightforward point that merely
being tactless is enough to piss off members of the electorate. If
Labour had avoided that, they might currently hold Barnet Council.
Labour has never held Barnet Council in its history.
A massive swing to Labour was never very likely there. But is it really
true that anyone was daft enough to vote Tory because they hated Ken
Livingstone?
The general reckoning was that when Boris stood against Ken, Ken's personal vote was ~-3% compared with other contests elsewhere, making Boris the Mayor of London.
Post by The Todal
In their fuddled brains, did they see him as a powerful
figure in the Shadow Cabinet and a potential future leader of the Labour
Party? Are such people fit to cast a vote at all?
Everyone normally is, even those sectioned.
Post by The Todal
Even Gorgeous George Galloway has now said that it's time for Ken to bow
out of politics.
George should take his own advice - he stood in Gorton last year after a huge by election campaign and only narrowly saved his deposit.
JNugent
2018-05-09 01:05:22 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process
has continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and
haven't voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.
Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.
I don't have any strong views about how the Labour Party governs its
membership. I was just making the very straightforward point that
merely being tactless is enough to piss off members of the electorate.
If Labour had avoided that, they might currently hold Barnet Council.
Labour has never held Barnet Council in its history.
A massive swing to Labour was never very likely there.
So why were the Labour Party swearing black was white that they were
going to be in control of it?
Post by The Todal
But is it really
true that anyone was daft enough to vote Tory because they hated Ken
Livingstone? In their fuddled brains, did they see him as a powerful
figure in the Shadow Cabinet and a potential future leader of the Labour
Party?
No. They saw him as the sinister, spiteful, dangerous anti-Semite that
he is.
Post by The Todal
Are such people fit to cast a vote at all?
Hating Mad Malicious Ken sounds like a good start, doesn't it?
Post by The Todal
Even Gorgeous George Galloway has now said that it's time for Ken to bow
out of politics.
Only because he knows what the effect on voters is - especially, it
seems, voters not keen on anti-semitism.
Sam Clark
2018-05-09 10:17:58 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Labour has never held Barnet Council in its history.
A massive swing to Labour was never very likely there.
I think there was a big swing to Labour in 2014 and that is the anomaly.
2018 appears to be a reversion to normal.

If we suspect Barnet of voting tribally, is it not more likely they
voted for the (Jewish) leader Ed Miliband in 2014 than against a minor
radio comment by an ex London mayor in 2018.
R. Mark Clayton
2018-05-09 14:37:49 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by The Todal
Labour has never held Barnet Council in its history.
A massive swing to Labour was never very likely there.
I think there was a big swing to Labour in 2014 and that is the anomaly.
2018 appears to be a reversion to normal.
If we suspect Barnet of voting tribally, is it not more likely they
voted for the (Jewish) leader Ed Miliband in 2014 than against a minor
radio comment by an ex London mayor in 2018.
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or Judas - interesting judgement call...
Sam Clark
2018-05-09 16:13:18 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or Judas - interesting judgement call...
This is kind of typical of my problems understanding the
Labour/Anti-Semitic discussion. There seems to be some suggestion or an
innuendo that Corbyn has behaved inappropriately or insensitively but I
have no idea what it is based upon?

Left wing Corbyn went to an event organised by some left wing Jews, what
is the problem with that?

Are you suggesting that he should have been sucking up to Tory Jews and
has made an error of judgement by not doing so?
R. Mark Clayton
2018-05-09 16:29:15 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or Judas - interesting judgement call...
This is kind of typical of my problems understanding the
Labour/Anti-Semitic discussion. There seems to be some suggestion or an
innuendo that Corbyn has behaved inappropriately or insensitively but I
have no idea what it is based upon?
Left wing Corbyn went to an event organised by some left wing Jews, what
is the problem with that?
Are you suggesting that he should have been sucking up to Tory Jews and
has made an error of judgement by not doing so?
Where do you get your info? Der Stürmer?
GB
2018-05-09 18:39:58 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over
Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or
Judas - interesting judgement call...
This is kind of typical of my problems understanding the
Labour/Anti-Semitic discussion. There seems to be some suggestion or an
innuendo that Corbyn has behaved inappropriately or insensitively but I
have no idea what it is based upon?
Jewdas is some guys having a laugh. They held their Passover Seder on 2
April. Virtually, every other Jew in the world held their Seder on 30
March. That's the correct night, according to the Jewish calendar.
Holding it 3 days later is like celebrating a Christmas Mass on 28
December.

By attending the Jewdas Seder, Corbyn was endorsing a fake ceremony (the
whole thing was a travesty, a lampoon, not just the date) - a deliberate
insult on the part of the jokesters at Jewdas aimed at most other Jews.
There's nothing wrong with that. They are entitled to their bit of fun.
But Corbyn was unwise to attend it, IMHO.

If Corbyn had attended an orgy on Good Friday to celebrate Jesus's
crucifixion it wouldn't have endeared him to most Christians. This was
much the same.

As I said before, some leading lights in the Labour Party seem to behave
with remarkable tactlessness towards the Jewish community. If it isn't
intentional, they desperately need a minder.
Post by Sam Clark
Left wing Corbyn went to an event organised by some left wing Jews, what
is the problem with that?
Now you know.
Post by Sam Clark
Are you suggesting that he should have been sucking up to Tory Jews and
has made an error of judgement by not doing so?
No. There are plenty of other Seders he could have attended.
The Todal
2018-05-09 22:01:04 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over
Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or
Judas - interesting judgement call...
This is kind of typical of my problems understanding the
Labour/Anti-Semitic discussion. There seems to be some suggestion or
an innuendo that Corbyn has behaved inappropriately or insensitively
but I have no idea what it is based upon?
Jewdas is some guys having a laugh. They held their Passover Seder on 2
April. Virtually, every other Jew in the world held their Seder on 30
March. That's the correct night, according to the Jewish calendar.
Holding it 3 days later is like celebrating a Christmas Mass on 28
December.
By attending the Jewdas Seder, Corbyn was endorsing a fake ceremony (the
whole thing was a travesty, a lampoon, not just the date) - a deliberate
insult on the part of the jokesters at Jewdas aimed at most other Jews.
There's nothing wrong with that. They are entitled to their bit of fun.
But Corbyn was unwise to attend it, IMHO.
If Corbyn had attended an orgy on Good Friday to celebrate Jesus's
crucifixion it wouldn't have endeared him to most Christians. This was
much the same.
As I said before, some leading lights in the Labour Party seem to behave
with remarkable tactlessness towards the Jewish community. If it isn't
intentional, they desperately need a minder.
Post by Sam Clark
Left wing Corbyn went to an event organised by some left wing Jews,
what is the problem with that?
Now you know.
It's only a problem for the right wing jews who are forever looking for
excuses to slag off Corbyn. They have far more air-time than they
deserve. Whining, complaining Tory jews. And nobody tells them to go
fuck themselves because hey, that must be antisemitic.
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Are you suggesting that he should have been sucking up to Tory Jews
and has made an error of judgement by not doing so?
No. There are plenty of other Seders he could have attended.
Really? Give a list. You presumably have access to his engagement diary.

You really don't get it, do you? The right wing jews aren't going to
invite him to a seder. They're going to invite him to a sit-down at
which they tell him off for being a socialist and present him with their
list of petty demands.
GB
2018-05-10 11:13:53 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over
Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or
Judas - interesting judgement call...
This is kind of typical of my problems understanding the
Labour/Anti-Semitic discussion. There seems to be some suggestion or
an innuendo that Corbyn has behaved inappropriately or insensitively
but I have no idea what it is based upon?
Jewdas is some guys having a laugh. They held their Passover Seder on
2 April. Virtually, every other Jew in the world held their Seder on
30 March. That's the correct night, according to the Jewish calendar.
Holding it 3 days later is like celebrating a Christmas Mass on 28
December.
By attending the Jewdas Seder, Corbyn was endorsing a fake ceremony
(the whole thing was a travesty, a lampoon, not just the date) - a
deliberate insult on the part of the jokesters at Jewdas aimed at most
other Jews. There's nothing wrong with that. They are entitled to
their bit of fun. But Corbyn was unwise to attend it, IMHO.
If Corbyn had attended an orgy on Good Friday to celebrate Jesus's
crucifixion it wouldn't have endeared him to most Christians. This was
much the same.
As I said before, some leading lights in the Labour Party seem to
behave with remarkable tactlessness towards the Jewish community. If
it isn't intentional, they desperately need a minder.
Post by Sam Clark
Left wing Corbyn went to an event organised by some left wing Jews,
what is the problem with that?
Now you know.
It's only a problem for the right wing jews who are forever looking for
excuses to slag off Corbyn.
I certainly accept that a load of Tories are revelling in any faux pas
(real or exaggerated) that Corbyn makes. But, the issue is that he has
pissed off a load of Labour supporters.
Post by The Todal
They have far more air-time than they
deserve. Whining, complaining Tory jews. And nobody tells them to go
fuck themselves because hey, that must be antisemitic.
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Are you suggesting that he should have been sucking up to Tory Jews
and has made an error of judgement by not doing so?
No. There are plenty of other Seders he could have attended.
Really? Give a list. You presumably have access to his engagement diary.
He could have come to my family's. It's a genuine seder, not a lampoon.
Maybe, you have a seder? Or, I guess there are some thousands of
Labourite Jews, who would have welcomed him as a guest.

But, even if he turned out to be Billy NoMates, and nobody wanted him,
he'd still have been wiser not to have attended anything at all than the
show he did attend.
Post by The Todal
You really don't get it, do you? The right wing jews aren't going to
invite him to a seder. They're going to invite him to a sit-down at
which they tell him off for being a socialist and present him with their
list of petty demands.
You appear to think that all even slightly traditional Jews are right wing.
Fredxx
2018-05-10 11:26:51 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over
Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or
Judas - interesting judgement call...
This is kind of typical of my problems understanding the
Labour/Anti-Semitic discussion. There seems to be some suggestion or
an innuendo that Corbyn has behaved inappropriately or insensitively
but I have no idea what it is based upon?
Jewdas is some guys having a laugh. They held their Passover Seder on
2 April. Virtually, every other Jew in the world held their Seder on
30 March. That's the correct night, according to the Jewish calendar.
Holding it 3 days later is like celebrating a Christmas Mass on 28
December.
By attending the Jewdas Seder, Corbyn was endorsing a fake ceremony
(the whole thing was a travesty, a lampoon, not just the date) - a
deliberate insult on the part of the jokesters at Jewdas aimed at
most other Jews. There's nothing wrong with that. They are entitled
to their bit of fun. But Corbyn was unwise to attend it, IMHO.
If Corbyn had attended an orgy on Good Friday to celebrate Jesus's
crucifixion it wouldn't have endeared him to most Christians. This
was much the same.
As I said before, some leading lights in the Labour Party seem to
behave with remarkable tactlessness towards the Jewish community. If
it isn't intentional, they desperately need a minder.
Post by Sam Clark
Left wing Corbyn went to an event organised by some left wing Jews,
what is the problem with that?
Now you know.
It's only a problem for the right wing jews who are forever looking
for excuses to slag off Corbyn.
I certainly accept that a load of Tories are revelling in any faux pas
(real or exaggerated) that Corbyn makes. But, the issue is that he has
pissed off a load of Labour supporters.
And most Labour MPs don't support his leadership.
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
They have far more air-time than they deserve. Whining, complaining
Tory jews. And nobody tells them to go fuck themselves because hey,
that must be antisemitic.
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Are you suggesting that he should have been sucking up to Tory Jews
and has made an error of judgement by not doing so?
No. There are plenty of other Seders he could have attended.
Really? Give a list. You presumably have access to his engagement diary.
He could have come to my family's. It's a genuine seder, not a lampoon.
Maybe, you have a seder? Or, I guess there are some thousands of
Labourite Jews, who would have welcomed him as a guest.
But, even if he turned out to be Billy NoMates, and nobody wanted him,
he'd still have been wiser not to have attended anything at all than the
show he did attend.
I think what he has done is shown the hypocrisy amongst jewish
supporters. Even you say he went to the 'wrong' seder.
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
You really don't get it, do you? The right wing jews aren't going to
invite him to a seder. They're going to invite him to a sit-down at
which they tell him off for being a socialist and present him with
their list of petty demands.
You appear to think that all even slightly traditional Jews are right wing.
Is that not the case? Can you provide stats to show otherwise? I thought
it was 63%:23% Tory:Labour

http://www.brin.ac.uk/2017/religious-affiliation-and-party-choice-at-the-2017-general-election/
GB
2018-05-10 11:47:26 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Fredxx
I think what he has done is shown the hypocrisy amongst jewish
supporters. Even you say he went to the 'wrong' seder.
He went to a piss-take and called it a seder.
Post by Fredxx
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
You really don't get it, do you? The right wing jews aren't going to
invite him to a seder. They're going to invite him to a sit-down at
which they tell him off for being a socialist and present him with
their list of petty demands.
You appear to think that all even slightly traditional Jews are right wing.
Is that not the case? Can you provide stats to show otherwise? I thought
it was 63%:23% Tory:Labour
You may be right that only a quarter of Jews vote Labour**. That still
leaves 100,000 Labour supporters, who might have invited him.


** About the same as CofE. RC seem to be stauncher Labour supporters. I
have no idea why.
Post by Fredxx
http://www.brin.ac.uk/2017/religious-affiliation-and-party-choice-at-the-2017-general-election/
Fredxx
2018-05-10 11:22:30 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over
Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or
Judas - interesting judgement call...
This is kind of typical of my problems understanding the
Labour/Anti-Semitic discussion. There seems to be some suggestion or
an innuendo that Corbyn has behaved inappropriately or insensitively
but I have no idea what it is based upon?
Jewdas is some guys having a laugh. They held their Passover Seder on 2
April. Virtually, every other Jew in the world held their Seder on 30
March. That's the correct night, according to the Jewish calendar.
Holding it 3 days later is like celebrating a Christmas Mass on 28
December.
After a cursory look, including wikipedia, I can't find any calculation
of the day. It is usually defined as a range. Other Passover Seders were
also held on the 2nd.

Some countries do indeed celebrate Christmas day on a different day to
ours. I wouldn't chastise anyone for going to christmas mass a day or so
early.
GB
2018-05-10 11:37:26 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Fredxx
Post by GB
Jewdas is some guys having a laugh. They held their Passover Seder on
2 April. Virtually, every other Jew in the world held their Seder on
30 March. That's the correct night, according to the Jewish calendar.
Holding it 3 days later is like celebrating a Christmas Mass on 28
December.
After a cursory look, including wikipedia, I can't find any calculation
of the day. It is usually defined as a range. Other Passover Seders were
also held on the 2nd.
There's a section in WP that reads:
"The Passover begins on the 15th day of the month of Nisan, which
typically falls in March or April of the Gregorian calendar. Passover is
a spring festival, so the 15th day of Nisan typically begins on the
night of a full moon after the northern vernal equinox.[14] However, due
to intercalary months or leap months falling after the vernal equinox,
Passover sometimes starts on the second full moon after vernal equinox,
as in 2016."
Post by Fredxx
Some countries do indeed celebrate Christmas day on a different day to
ours. I wouldn't chastise anyone for going to christmas mass a day or so
early.
I wasn't chastising Jewdas for holding their bit of fun 3 days late. I
was pointing out that it was not a seder. One reason they may have held
it late is that some of their members may have been attending genuine
seders on the correct date.

Corbyn was endorsing a deliberate lampoon of an important Jewish
religious festival. I can't see what he could possibly hope to gain from
that, which is why I suggested he needs minding. It may even be that he
thought he was demonstrating his solidarity with Jews, which simply
strengthens my point.
pensive hamster
2018-05-10 17:45:30 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thursday, 10 May 2018 12:37:31 UTC+1, GB wrote:
[...]
Post by GB
Corbyn was endorsing a deliberate lampoon of an important Jewish
religious festival. I can't see what he could possibly hope to gain from
that, which is why I suggested he needs minding. It may even be that he
thought he was demonstrating his solidarity with Jews, which simply
strengthens my point.
Boris Johnson is another who might benefit from a minder,
steering him away from upsetting various minorities.

Being Corbyn's minder would probably be a bit of an uphill
struggle. Corbyn isn't the smoothest of operators, and seems
rather unconcerned about (or even unaware of) the kind of
image he might be projecting.

But in a way, that kind of honesty seems preferable to the
image-conscious, focus-group driven politics of the Blair era.
The Todal
2018-05-11 08:22:32 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by GB
Corbyn was endorsing a deliberate lampoon of an important Jewish
religious festival. I can't see what he could possibly hope to gain from
that, which is why I suggested he needs minding. It may even be that he
thought he was demonstrating his solidarity with Jews, which simply
strengthens my point.
Boris Johnson is another who might benefit from a minder,
steering him away from upsetting various minorities.
Being Corbyn's minder would probably be a bit of an uphill
struggle. Corbyn isn't the smoothest of operators, and seems
rather unconcerned about (or even unaware of) the kind of
image he might be projecting.
But in a way, that kind of honesty seems preferable to the
image-conscious, focus-group driven politics of the Blair era.
I see nothing whatsoever to criticise about Corbyn's decision to meet
with the jewdas group. In fact, it was absolutely the right thing to do.

The right-wing jews who are currently persecuting him are actually
fostering antisemitism, but they seem to be too dimwitted to realise it,
or else they cynically want to harness that antisemitism to help their
cause.

When people are asked in a survey "do jews have too much power in the
media" the correct answer is of course "no". "Yes" means that you are
antisemitic. But the plain fact of the matter is that right wing jews
currently have too much influence in British politics. Left wing jews
are ignored, sidelined, mocked for being traitors to the jewish community.
GB
2018-05-11 11:58:55 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by GB
Corbyn was endorsing a deliberate lampoon of an important Jewish
religious festival. I can't see what he could possibly hope to gain from
that, which is why I suggested he needs minding. It may even be that he
thought he was demonstrating his solidarity with Jews, which simply
strengthens my point.
Boris Johnson is another who might benefit from a minder,
steering him away from upsetting various minorities.
Being Corbyn's minder would probably be a bit of an uphill
struggle. Corbyn isn't the smoothest of operators, and seems
rather unconcerned about (or even unaware of) the kind of
image he might be projecting.
But in a way, that kind of honesty seems preferable to the
image-conscious, focus-group driven politics of the Blair era.
I see nothing whatsoever to criticise about Corbyn's decision to meet
with the jewdas group. In fact, it was absolutely the right thing to do.
Perhaps you could explain that a bit more, please?
Post by The Todal
The right-wing jews who are currently persecuting him
I know plenty of left-wing Jews who are upset by him.
Post by The Todal
are actually
fostering antisemitism,
Are they? He's leader of the Labour Party, and his actions should be
subject to scrutiny and comment, so your use of the word "persecuting"
is entirely wrong. Surely, Jewish Labour Party members facing
unreasonable behaviour have every right to say so?
Sam Clark
2018-05-11 17:53:35 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Are they? He's leader of the Labour Party, and his actions should be
subject to scrutiny and comment, so your use of the word "persecuting"
is entirely wrong. Surely, Jewish Labour Party members facing
unreasonable behaviour have every right to say so?
Do you have any specific examples of the unreasonable behaviour
Jewish Labour party members have faced?


I have asked you a very similar question already in this thread. I don't
think it is reasonable for you to predicate an argument on the existence
of unreasonable behaviour if you are unwilling to demonstrate that such
unreasonable behaviour exists.
GB
2018-05-11 18:08:36 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Are they? He's leader of the Labour Party, and his actions should be
subject to scrutiny and comment, so your use of the word "persecuting"
is entirely wrong. Surely, Jewish Labour Party members facing
unreasonable behaviour have every right to say so?
Do you have any specific examples of the unreasonable behaviour
Jewish Labour party members have faced?
I have asked you a very similar question already in this thread. I don't
think it is reasonable for you to predicate an argument on the existence
of unreasonable behaviour if you are unwilling to demonstrate that such
unreasonable behaviour exists.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-mps-call-for-action-in-emotional-anti-semitism-debate-11335825

"And yes, as I've said outside this place in Parliament Square, and it
pains me to say this proudly as the chair of the Jewish Labour Movement,
in 2018 within the Labour Party anti-Semitism is more commonplace, is
more conspicuous and is more corrosive."

Sheesh, which planet are you on?

I'm not particularly interested in labour in-fighting (I tend to vote
LibDem if anyone is interested), and the above was the first link google
found. It's strange that you can't use google, too. It's free, you know. :p
Sam Clark
2018-05-11 19:04:26 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Are they? He's leader of the Labour Party, and his actions should be
subject to scrutiny and comment, so your use of the word
"persecuting" is entirely wrong. Surely, Jewish Labour Party members
facing unreasonable behaviour have every right to say so?
Do you have any specific examples of the unreasonable behaviour
Jewish Labour party members have faced?
I have asked you a very similar question already in this thread. I
don't think it is reasonable for you to predicate an argument on the
existence of unreasonable behaviour if you are unwilling to
demonstrate that such unreasonable behaviour exists.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-mps-call-for-action-in-emotional-anti-semitism-debate-11335825
"And yes, as I've said outside this place in Parliament Square, and it
pains me to say this proudly as the chair of the Jewish Labour Movement,
in 2018 within the Labour Party anti-Semitism is more commonplace, is
more conspicuous and is more corrosive."
Sheesh, which planet are you on?
I'm not particularly interested in labour in-fighting (I tend to vote
LibDem if anyone is interested), and the above was the first link google
found. It's strange that you can't use google, too. It's free, you know. :p
So we are talking online abuse? The kind we all get, all the time.

For instance in this very thread; R Mark Clayton, Wed, 9 May 2018 17:29:15.

"Where do you get your info? Der Stürmer?".

I find that pretty fucking offensive, don't you?

I notice you didn't offer any support for me or even mention Mark's vile
abuse when you responded to the same post. I also notice you do appear
to have defended the same Mr Clayton from personal abuse a few minutes
ago. Do you not think he should be expelled from the Liberal Democrats?

Vince Cable clearly has questions to answer!

Do you see why people think there is a double standard being applied?
GB
2018-05-11 20:54:53 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Are they? He's leader of the Labour Party, and his actions should be
subject to scrutiny and comment, so your use of the word
"persecuting" is entirely wrong. Surely, Jewish Labour Party members
facing unreasonable behaviour have every right to say so?
Do you have any specific examples of the unreasonable behaviour
Jewish Labour party members have faced?
I have asked you a very similar question already in this thread. I
don't think it is reasonable for you to predicate an argument on the
existence of unreasonable behaviour if you are unwilling to
demonstrate that such unreasonable behaviour exists.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-mps-call-for-action-in-emotional-anti-semitism-debate-11335825
"And yes, as I've said outside this place in Parliament Square, and it
pains me to say this proudly as the chair of the Jewish Labour
Movement, in 2018 within the Labour Party anti-Semitism is more
commonplace, is more conspicuous and is more corrosive."
Sheesh, which planet are you on?
I'm not particularly interested in labour in-fighting (I tend to vote
LibDem if anyone is interested), and the above was the first link
google found. It's strange that you can't use google, too. It's free,
you know. :p
So we are talking online abuse? The kind we all get, all the time.
For instance in this very thread; R Mark Clayton, Wed, 9 May 2018 17:29:15.
"Where do you get your info? Der Stürmer?".
I find that pretty fucking offensive, don't you?
I notice you didn't offer any support for me or even mention Mark's vile
abuse when you responded to the same post. I also notice you do appear
to have defended the same Mr Clayton from personal abuse a few minutes
ago. Do you not think he should be expelled from the Liberal Democrats?
Vince Cable clearly has questions to answer!
Do you see why people think there is a double standard being applied?
No, I'm afraid that Usenet is full of abuse. You have not intervened
even once when the rabid idiot from Serbia posts completely mad abuse.
Until you do, you can't possibly complain that you are being abused. Sorry!
R. Mark Clayton
2018-05-12 09:19:45 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Are they? He's leader of the Labour Party, and his actions should be
subject to scrutiny and comment, so your use of the word
"persecuting" is entirely wrong. Surely, Jewish Labour Party members
facing unreasonable behaviour have every right to say so?
Do you have any specific examples of the unreasonable behaviour
Jewish Labour party members have faced?
I have asked you a very similar question already in this thread. I
don't think it is reasonable for you to predicate an argument on the
existence of unreasonable behaviour if you are unwilling to
demonstrate that such unreasonable behaviour exists.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-mps-call-for-action-in-emotional-anti-semitism-debate-11335825
"And yes, as I've said outside this place in Parliament Square, and it
pains me to say this proudly as the chair of the Jewish Labour Movement,
in 2018 within the Labour Party anti-Semitism is more commonplace, is
more conspicuous and is more corrosive."
Sheesh, which planet are you on?
I'm not particularly interested in labour in-fighting (I tend to vote
LibDem if anyone is interested), and the above was the first link google
found. It's strange that you can't use google, too. It's free, you know. :p
So we are talking online abuse? The kind we all get, all the time.
For instance in this very thread; R Mark Clayton, Wed, 9 May 2018 17:29:15.
"Where do you get your info? Der Stürmer?".
I find that pretty fucking offensive, don't you?
That was in response to you posting "sucking up to Tory Jews" -
1. Was that your own language or something you read somewhere else?
and
2. It referred to what you posted, not to you personally.

See the bit about "standing shoulder to shoulder with Tory Jews" in here: -
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5553277/Labour-MPs-deluged-hate-mail-attending-anti-Semitism-protest.html
Post by Sam Clark
I notice you didn't offer any support for me or even mention Mark's vile
abuse when you responded to the same post. I also notice you do appear
to have defended the same Mr Clayton from personal abuse a few minutes
ago. Do you not think he should be expelled from the Liberal Democrats?
Vince Cable clearly has questions to answer!
Do you see why people think there is a double standard being applied?
JNugent
2018-05-11 16:02:26 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by GB
Corbyn was endorsing a deliberate lampoon of an important Jewish
religious festival. I can't see what he could possibly hope to gain from
that, which is why I suggested he needs minding. It may even be that he
thought he was demonstrating his solidarity with Jews, which simply
strengthens my point.
Boris Johnson is another who might benefit from a minder,
steering him away from upsetting various minorities.
Being Corbyn's minder would probably be a bit of an uphill
struggle. Corbyn isn't the smoothest of operators, and seems
rather unconcerned about (or even unaware of) the kind of
image he might be projecting.
But in a way, that kind of honesty seems preferable to the
image-conscious, focus-group driven politics of the Blair era.
I see nothing whatsoever to criticise about Corbyn's decision to meet
with the jewdas group. In fact, it was absolutely the right thing to do.
The right-wing jews who are currently persecuting him are actually
fostering antisemitism, but they seem to be too dimwitted to realise it,
or else they cynically want to harness that antisemitism to help their
cause.
When people are asked in a survey "do jews have too much power in the
media" the correct answer is of course "no". "Yes" means that you are
antisemitic. But the plain fact of the matter is that right wing jews
currently have too much influence in British politics. Left wing jews
are ignored, sidelined, mocked for being traitors to the jewish community.
"right wing jews currently have too much influence in British politics".

Note that you don't say "the right wing has too much influence", which
is what you'd expect someone like to say anyway. You specifically
separate out "right-wing jews" from everyone else on the right-wing.

Why is that?

It is because you believe that jews as a group have too much influence.

And we know a word for that, don't we?
Fredxx
2018-05-11 20:13:18 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by JNugent
Post by The Todal
Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by GB
Corbyn was endorsing a deliberate lampoon of an important Jewish
religious festival. I can't see what he could possibly hope to gain from
that, which is why I suggested he needs minding. It may even be that he
thought he was demonstrating his solidarity with Jews, which simply
strengthens my point.
Boris Johnson is another who might benefit from a minder,
steering him away from upsetting various minorities.
Being Corbyn's minder would probably be a bit of an uphill
struggle. Corbyn isn't the smoothest of operators, and seems
rather unconcerned about (or even unaware of) the kind of
image he might be projecting.
But in a way, that kind of honesty seems preferable to the
image-conscious, focus-group driven politics of the Blair era.
I see nothing whatsoever to criticise about Corbyn's decision to meet
with the jewdas group. In fact, it was absolutely the right thing to do.
The right-wing jews who are currently persecuting him are actually
fostering antisemitism, but they seem to be too dimwitted to realise
it, or else they cynically want to harness that antisemitism to help
their cause.
When people are asked in a survey "do jews have too much power in the
media" the correct answer is of course "no". "Yes" means that you are
antisemitic. But the plain fact of the matter is that right wing jews
currently have too much influence in British politics. Left wing jews
are ignored, sidelined, mocked for being traitors to the jewish community.
"right wing jews currently have too much influence in British politics".
Note that you don't say "the right wing has too much influence", which
is what you'd expect someone like to say anyway. You specifically
separate out "right-wing jews" from everyone else on the right-wing.
Why is that?
It is because you believe that jews as a group have too much influence.
A very good example of an abusive level of sensitivity when looking at
the BBC top wages of men, and top wages of Jewesses.

Did you see any editors sacked over their articles complaining men are
paid more than women in the BBC?
Post by JNugent
And we know a word for that, don't we?
Yes, hypocrisy.
Judith
2018-05-11 16:26:19 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by R. Mark Clayton
Don't know about the latter, but there was that big furore over Passover and then Corbyn went to some event organised by Jewdas or Judas - interesting judgement call...
This is kind of typical of my problems understanding the
Labour/Anti-Semitic discussion. There seems to be some suggestion or an
innuendo that Corbyn has behaved inappropriately or insensitively but I
have no idea what it is based upon?
Left wing Corbyn went to an event organised by some left wing Jews, what
is the problem with that?
Are you suggesting that he should have been sucking up to Tory Jews and
has made an error of judgement by not doing so?
The problem is that he (any many other Labour people) are very much
anti-Zionist and are not happy with how Israel has treated the Palestinians.

Hence they are all "anti-Semitic".
GB
2018-05-11 16:54:47 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Judith
The problem is that he (any many other Labour people) are very much
anti-Zionist and are not happy with how Israel has treated the Palestinians.
Hence they are all "anti-Semitic".
In that case, he and you are conflating two very, very different issues.
It is not possible to be Jewish and not wish for a return of the Jewish
people to Zion. It's part of the religion, and it has been since the
Romans forced the Jews out of their homeland 2000 years ago. So, being
anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic.

Being critical of the Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is a very
different issue (and vice versa, by the way).
jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
2018-05-11 17:06:42 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Fri, 11 May 2018 17:54:47 +0100, jewboi GB (jb)
Post by GB
Post by Judith
The problem is that he (any many other Labour people) are very much
anti-Zionist and are not happy with how Israel has treated the Palestinians.
Hence they are all "anti-Semitic".
In that case, he and you are conflating two very, very different issues.
It is not possible to be Jewish and not wish for a return of the Jewish
people to Zion. It's part of the religion, and it has been since the
Romans forced the Jews out of their homeland 2000 years ago. So, being
anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic.
Forced? You subpeople FLED your alleged historic homeland ('given' to
you by the jew g-d) so you could make more money in the diaspora!
Post by GB
Being critical of the Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is a very
different issue (and vice versa, by the way).
The days of 'Israeel' are numbered. It won't be an issue for much
longer.

--

"You are full of shit. You'll never convince any of us real Jews that
there is no Jewish look. I know my people and I can see their
Jewishness. Susan is not a Jew. If you want to get down her panties
just ask her she'll let you. She's a non-Jew."
Message-ID: <bfbdb526-1042-4e8e-a39f-***@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>

"You can try all you want and get all the plastic surgery you want but
you'll never look like one of us because you are not a Jew. You are
an Irish Shiksa that Isn't even a righteous non-Jew a Ger Tzadeck You
are VEEDMUS amongst us and are a gentile. I would not be surprised if
you ever go to Eretz Israel and spout off your non-senseical lies that
a Jew doesn't kill you or a gentile murder you. You are wicked because
you antagonize and lie about the Tzadeckim. The best place for you is
scrubbing toilets and urinals in a gymnasium that is predominate used
by Negros."
Message-ID: <ee17d097-89f7-4e72-a41a-***@p2g2000prn.googlegroups.com>

- drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish, mocking neo-jew Suzy KKKohen's
attempted 'conversion' to the jew race

"Warren is not well. He's a non-Jewish mental patient who usually declines to
take his medications. Please keep this in mind when viewing future posts."
Message-ID: <JZQTk.1726$***@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>

- neo-jew 'convert' Suzy KKKohen, mocking drug-fucked jew wannabe Y-chi Netfish's
claim to be a jew
The Peeler
2018-05-11 19:41:48 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Fri, 11 May 2018 10:06:42 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass
of herself as "jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry'
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
Post by GB
In that case, he and you are conflating two very, very different issues.
It is not possible to be Jewish and not wish for a return of the Jewish
people to Zion. It's part of the religion, and it has been since the
Romans forced the Jews out of their homeland 2000 years ago. So, being
anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic.
Forced? You subpeople FLED your alleged historic homeland ('given' to
you by the jew g-d) so you could make more money in the diaspora!
Isn't that actually what YOU did when you left your serbian farm to make
money in the UK, you serb peasant who projects the very moment she opens her
stupid psychotic gob?
Post by jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry' Shein's jew aliash)
Post by GB
Being critical of the Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is a very
different issue (and vice versa, by the way).
The days of 'Israeel' are numbered. It won't be an issue for much
longer.
ONLY in your miserable psychotic "mind" (if one can call that abnormal
perverted degenerate thing you are suffering from a "mind" at all), you
psychotic housebound loser! LOL
--
Dumb serb Razovic trying to peddle used satellite dishes on Usenet LOL:
"If you are in London or nearby, please e-mail me (***@callnetuk.com) - I
may have one available."
Fredxx
2018-05-11 20:16:50 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by Judith
The problem is that he (any many other Labour people) are very much
anti-Zionist and are not happy with how Israel has treated the Palestinians.
Hence they are all "anti-Semitic".
In that case, he and you are conflating two very, very different issues.
It is not possible to be Jewish and not wish for a return of the Jewish
people to Zion. It's part of the religion, and it has been since the
Romans forced the Jews out of their homeland 2000 years ago. So, being
anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic.
Utter cobblers.
Post by GB
Being critical of the Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is a very
different issue (and vice versa, by the way).
You seem to be conflating Zion and the treatment of Palestinians, when
their territory is being occupied (Zion).

I suggest you think this through.
The Todal
2018-05-13 10:45:44 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by Judith
The problem is that he (any many other Labour people) are very much
anti-Zionist and are not happy with how Israel has treated the Palestinians.
Hence they are all "anti-Semitic".
In that case, he and you are conflating two very, very different issues.
It is not possible to be Jewish and not wish for a return of the Jewish
people to Zion.
Come off it. Surely you can see that your statement is false. Jews live
all over the world. Some of them long to return to London, or Budapest,
or New York or wherever. Few care about herding the jews into Israel. It
was once part of a nostalgic romantic tradition in judaism especially as
a response to pogroms and to the hostility of gentile communities. It
isn't now to be regarded as a literal aspiration except among Zionist
extremists and zealots who want to grab ever more Palestinian land.



It's part of the religion, and it has been since the
Post by GB
Romans forced the Jews out of their homeland 2000 years ago. So, being
anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic.
Being critical of the Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is a very
different issue (and vice versa, by the way).
You will find that most right wing reactionary jews cite, as their main
complaint about Corbyn and the Labour Party, the fact that they "keep
picking on Israel" and don't spend at least as much time criticising
Syria, Saudi Arabia, the Emirates etc.
GB
2018-05-13 20:13:29 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by Judith
The problem is that he (any many other Labour people) are very much
anti-Zionist and are not happy with how Israel has treated the Palestinians.
Hence they are all "anti-Semitic".
In that case, he and you are conflating two very, very different
issues. It is not possible to be Jewish and not wish for a return of
the Jewish people to Zion.
Come off it. Surely you can see that your statement is false. Jews live
all over the world. Some of them long to return to London, or Budapest,
or New York or wherever. Few care about herding the jews into Israel. It
was once part of a nostalgic romantic tradition in judaism especially as
a response to pogroms and to the hostility of gentile communities. It
isn't now to be regarded as a literal aspiration except among Zionist
extremists and zealots who want to grab ever more Palestinian land.
I agree that some Jews are not very religious. That doesn't change the
religion.
Post by The Todal
 It's part of the religion, and it has been since the
Post by GB
Romans forced the Jews out of their homeland 2000 years ago. So, being
anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic.
Being critical of the Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is a very
different issue (and vice versa, by the way).
You will find that most right wing reactionary jews cite, as their main
complaint about Corbyn and the Labour Party, the fact that they "keep
picking on Israel" and don't spend at least as much time criticising
Syria, Saudi Arabia, the Emirates etc.
Why is that?
The Todal
2018-05-14 09:39:03 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by Judith
The problem is that he (any many other Labour people) are very much
anti-Zionist and are not happy with how Israel has treated the Palestinians.
Hence they are all "anti-Semitic".
In that case, he and you are conflating two very, very different
issues. It is not possible to be Jewish and not wish for a return of
the Jewish people to Zion.
Come off it. Surely you can see that your statement is false. Jews
live all over the world. Some of them long to return to London, or
Budapest, or New York or wherever. Few care about herding the jews
into Israel. It was once part of a nostalgic romantic tradition in
judaism especially as a response to pogroms and to the hostility of
gentile communities. It isn't now to be regarded as a literal
aspiration except among Zionist extremists and zealots who want to
grab ever more Palestinian land.
I agree that some Jews are not very religious. That doesn't change the
religion.
To say that the jewish religion demands that ever more land be stolen
from the Palestinians is as disgraceful a slur as the misconception that
Islam requires its followers to kill or enslave non-Muslims.

The twaddle from old religious books is widely, and rightly, disregarded
by the vast majority of people.
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
  It's part of the religion, and it has been since the
Post by GB
Romans forced the Jews out of their homeland 2000 years ago. So,
being anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic.
Being critical of the Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is a very
different issue (and vice versa, by the way).
You will find that most right wing reactionary jews cite, as their
main complaint about Corbyn and the Labour Party, the fact that they
"keep picking on Israel" and don't spend at least as much time
criticising Syria, Saudi Arabia, the Emirates etc.
Why is that?
Because many right wing jews are incapable of understanding the real
meaning of antisemitism. They are certainly not the best people to
consult if there is any doubt.

The new President of the Board of Deputies has announced that Labour
must expel both Ken Livingstone and Jackie Walker. Most people know the
case against Ken Livingstone and now that both George Galloway and Shami
Chakrabarti have expressed the hope that he'll be thrown out of the
party, it's obvious that his support is ebbing away because the arrogant
old man won't acknowledge the offence he has caused.

But Jackie Walker is actually innocent of any charges of antisemitism
and the persecution of her is a silly knee-jerk reaction by ignorant
zealots. There isn't even a rational debate about Walker. I don't
suppose even one person in a million knows what she is supposed to have
said. But the vengeful Board of Deputies insists on her expulsion
nevertheless.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/14/labour-ken-livingstone-jackie-walker-antisemitism-row
GB
2018-05-14 10:41:41 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by The Todal
To say that the jewish religion demands that ever more land be stolen
from the Palestinians is as disgraceful a slur as the misconception that
Islam requires its followers to kill or enslave non-Muslims.
Of course, I didn't say that or mean that, as you well know. Sometimes,
you show signs of your training as a lawyer.
Post by The Todal
The twaddle from old religious books is widely, and rightly, disregarded
by the vast majority of people.
Logically, there can be no justification for the word 'rightly', as you
can't prove that God doesn't exist.
Post by The Todal
I don't
suppose even one person in a million knows what she is supposed to have
said. But the vengeful Board of Deputies insists on her expulsion
nevertheless.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/14/labour-ken-livingstone-jackie-walker-antisemitism-row
Can I just check something. All this antisemitism exaggeration you
complain about is according to you down to right wing Jews. I know you
support Momentum, so I guess that you must find that rather a lot of
people are further right than you, but does that make them right wing, I
wonder? I ask, because the chief concerns voiced about Ms Walker came
from the Jewish Labour Movement. Not an obviously right wing
organisation, but maybe they appear so from your perspective?

Perhaps a majority of the parliamentary labour party appear right wing
to you?
Fredxx
2018-05-14 10:49:07 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
To say that the jewish religion demands that ever more land be stolen
from the Palestinians is as disgraceful a slur as the misconception
that Islam requires its followers to kill or enslave non-Muslims.
Of course, I didn't say that or mean that, as you well know. Sometimes,
you show signs of your training as a lawyer.
Post by The Todal
The twaddle from old religious books is widely, and rightly,
disregarded by the vast majority of people.
Logically, there can be no justification for the word 'rightly', as you
can't prove that God doesn't exist.
Nothing can be proven according to Heisenberg. It's easier to prove
beyond reasonable doubt.
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
I don't suppose even one person in a million knows what she is
supposed to have said. But the vengeful Board of Deputies insists on
her expulsion nevertheless.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/14/labour-ken-livingstone-jackie-walker-antisemitism-row
Can I just check something. All this antisemitism exaggeration you
complain about is according to you down to right wing Jews. I know you
support Momentum, so I guess that you must find that rather a lot of
people are further right than you, but does that make them right wing, I
wonder? I ask, because the chief concerns voiced about Ms Walker came
from the Jewish Labour Movement. Not an obviously right wing
organisation, but maybe they appear so from your perspective?
Perhaps a majority of the parliamentary labour party appear right wing
to you?
I have already posted the ratio of Jews voting Tory:Labour. As a
community it is just to say Jews are generally anti-Labour as are
prestigious parts of Surrey.

Or is accusing Surrey of being right of centre anti-semetic?
GB
2018-05-14 11:01:54 UTC
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Post by Fredxx
I have already posted the ratio of Jews voting Tory:Labour.
About 2:1 IIRC. About the same as CofE.
Post by Fredxx
As a
community it is just to say Jews are generally anti-Labour as are
prestigious parts of Surrey.
Or is accusing Surrey of being right of centre anti-semetic?
Todal uses "right wing" as an insult. Anyone right wing is wrong-headed,
and any conclusion they come to is untrustworthy.
The Todal
2018-05-15 16:56:44 UTC
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Post by GB
Post by Fredxx
I have already posted the ratio of Jews voting Tory:Labour.
About 2:1 IIRC. About the same as CofE.
Post by Fredxx
As a community it is just to say Jews are generally anti-Labour as are
prestigious parts of Surrey.
Or is accusing Surrey of being right of centre anti-semetic?
Todal uses "right wing" as an insult. Anyone right wing is wrong-headed,
and any conclusion they come to is untrustworthy.
Untrue.

Anyone right wing is likely to support the Tories rather than Labour and
Blair rather than Corbyn. That is their right, of course. But they
shouldn't tell fibs and pretend that they represent all jews in the
Labour Party.
GB
2018-05-16 09:02:24 UTC
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Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Todal uses "right wing" as an insult. Anyone right wing is
wrong-headed, and any conclusion they come to is untrustworthy.
Untrue.
I'll accept there was a certain amount of exaggeration involved, but
there's a kernel of truth there.
Post by The Todal
Anyone right wing is likely to support the Tories rather than Labour and
Blair rather than Corbyn. That is their right, of course. But they
shouldn't tell fibs and pretend that they represent all jews in the
Labour Party.
I cannot see how anyone could possibly hope to represent such a diverse
group. I'm truly surprised that anybody has claimed to do so?

On a more general point, Blair may well have been on the right wing of
the Labour Party, but I think one can reasonably distinguish him from
say Tea Party members or Margaret Thatcher. To lump them all in together
is confusing for us ordinary folk, who aren't members of the Momentum
clique and familiar with its Newspeak.
The Todal
2018-05-16 10:07:32 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Todal uses "right wing" as an insult. Anyone right wing is
wrong-headed, and any conclusion they come to is untrustworthy.
Untrue.
I'll accept there was a certain amount of exaggeration involved, but
there's a kernel of truth there.
Not as far as I'm concerned. I'm good friends with several Tories
including some who actively campaign for the Conservative Party in
elections.
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Anyone right wing is likely to support the Tories rather than Labour
and Blair rather than Corbyn. That is their right, of course. But they
shouldn't tell fibs and pretend that they represent all jews in the
Labour Party.
I cannot see how anyone could possibly hope to represent such a diverse
group. I'm truly surprised that anybody has claimed to do so?
Yes, I was surprised too. You may recall that there was a big demo in
Parliament Square on 26th March, organised by several jewish groups, to
protest specifically against antisemitism in the Labour Party. The usual
self-important anti-Corbynites made a conspicuous appearance at the demo
and took to the stand to address the crowd, accusing Labour of being an
antisemitic party and Corbyn of encouraging and condoning antisemitism.
Some of us were part of a small counter-demonstration organised by
Jewish Voice for Labour, which supports Corbyn. The various jewish MPs
(Ruth Smeeth etc) then took to the airwaves to condemn us as not
representative of Labour jews or jews at all, accusing us of being
divisive and of condoning antisemitism.

Even John Mann, the loudmouthed bore who engineered a public shouting
match with Livingstone, but isn't Jewish himself, claims to have a
better right to represent jews in the Labour Party than anyone loyal to
Corbyn.
Post by GB
On a more general point, Blair may well have been on the right wing of
the Labour Party, but I think one can reasonably distinguish him from
say Tea Party members or Margaret Thatcher. To lump them all in together
is confusing for us ordinary folk, who aren't members of the Momentum
clique and familiar with its Newspeak.
You've been misled again. Momentum doesn't say bad things about Tony
Blair, it focuses purely on mobilising votes for the current Labour
Party and getting members to come out and canvass and campaign. It
doesn't plot to reselect MPs or to undermine right wing MPs. It isn't
the modern version of Militant.

There is a well-organised group of Labour members that does plot to
undermine Corbyn and to deselect his supporters. It is organised by one
Luke Akehurst and one of its names is Progress. Its members yearn for
the days of Tony Blair when Labour won elections by appealing to the
wealthy middle classes. So it's fair to call them Blairites but actually
you can be suspended by the Labour Party if you use the word Blairites
in social media.
JNugent
2018-05-16 10:15:12 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Todal uses "right wing" as an insult. Anyone right wing is
wrong-headed, and any conclusion they come to is untrustworthy.
Untrue.
I'll accept there was a certain amount of exaggeration involved, but
there's a kernel of truth there.
Not as far as I'm concerned. I'm good friends with several Tories
including some who actively campaign for the Conservative Party in
elections.
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Anyone right wing is likely to support the Tories rather than Labour
and Blair rather than Corbyn. That is their right, of course. But
they shouldn't tell fibs and pretend that they represent all jews in
the Labour Party.
I cannot see how anyone could possibly hope to represent such a
diverse group. I'm truly surprised that anybody has claimed to do so?
Yes, I was surprised too. You may recall that there was a big demo in
Parliament Square on 26th March, organised by several jewish groups, to
protest specifically against antisemitism in the Labour Party. The usual
self-important anti-Corbynites made a conspicuous appearance at the demo
and took to the stand to address the crowd, accusing Labour of being an
antisemitic party and Corbyn of encouraging and condoning antisemitism.
Some of us were part of a small counter-demonstration organised by
Jewish Voice for Labour, which supports Corbyn. The various jewish MPs
(Ruth Smeeth etc) then took to the airwaves to condemn us as not
representative of Labour jews or jews at all, accusing us of being
divisive and of condoning antisemitism.
Are you jewish?

If you aren't, it's hard to see how you can represent any group of Jews
unless you have been elected in a civil election (council, Parliament,
etc for an earlier which is predominantly jewish) or been retained as
the representative of a group of jewish people.
Post by The Todal
Even John Mann, the loudmouthed bore who engineered a public shouting
match with Livingstone, but isn't Jewish himself, claims to have a
better right to represent jews in the Labour Party than anyone loyal to
Corbyn.
Perhaps he isn't antisemitic?

Just a thought...
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
On a more general point, Blair may well have been on the right wing of
the Labour Party, but I think one can reasonably distinguish him from
say Tea Party members or Margaret Thatcher. To lump them all in
together is confusing for us ordinary folk, who aren't members of the
Momentum clique and familiar with its Newspeak.
You've been misled again. Momentum doesn't say bad things about Tony
Blair, it focuses purely on mobilising votes for the current Labour
Party and getting members to come out and canvass and campaign. It
doesn't plot to reselect MPs or to undermine right wing MPs. It isn't
the modern version of Militant.
No, it IS Militant, resurfaced now that it is "safe" to do so.
Post by The Todal
There is a well-organised group of Labour members that does plot to
undermine Corbyn and to deselect his supporters. It is organised by one
Luke Akehurst and one of its names is Progress.  Its members yearn for
the days of Tony Blair when Labour won elections by appealing to the
wealthy middle classes. So it's fair to call them Blairites but actually
you can be suspended by the Labour Party if you use the word Blairites
in social media.
You're suspended.

Don't mention J*****h, or you risk being stoned to death.
GB
2018-05-16 11:57:02 UTC
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Post by JNugent
Are you jewish?
That's an interesting question. I always thought Todal is Jewish, but in
the past on Usenet he has stated he is not Jewish. I remember it because
I was quite surprised at the time.

One strange thing about Jews is that we are still Jewish even if we are
atheists.
Judith
2018-05-15 23:03:00 UTC
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On Mon, 14 May 2018 12:01:54 +0100, GB <***@microsoft.com> wrote:

<snip>
Post by GB
Anyone right wing is wrong-headed,
and any conclusion they come to is untrustworthy.
For once I agree with you.
Sam Clark
2018-05-14 14:54:26 UTC
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Post by Fredxx
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
The twaddle from old religious books is widely, and rightly,
disregarded by the vast majority of people.
Logically, there can be no justification for the word 'rightly', as
you can't prove that God doesn't exist.
Nothing can be proven according to Heisenberg.
I think you mean Kurt Gödel not Heisenberg.

Gödel in essence proved "That it is impossible to prove a complex set of
axioms is consistent using only that set of axioms itself."

This is often interpreted as you can't prove anything reasonably complex.

The actual obvious counter argument to GB is that if we are expected to
believe something exceptional, such as a major religion, we should have
a strong reason to do so, i.e. strong evidence.

Instead there is no particular reason to favour one religion over
another and that religions are self contradictory.
Fredxx
2018-05-14 22:58:40 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by Fredxx
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
The twaddle from old religious books is widely, and rightly,
disregarded by the vast majority of people.
Logically, there can be no justification for the word 'rightly', as
you can't prove that God doesn't exist.
Nothing can be proven according to Heisenberg.
I think you mean Kurt Gödel not Heisenberg.
I was thinking of the uncertainty theorem, in that any object can be in
any place.
Post by Sam Clark
Gödel in essence proved "That it is impossible to prove a complex set of
axioms is consistent using only that set of axioms itself."
This is often interpreted as you can't prove anything reasonably complex.
The actual obvious counter argument to GB is that if we are expected to
believe something exceptional, such as a major religion, we should have
a strong reason to do so, i.e. strong evidence.
Instead there is no particular reason to favour one religion over
another and that religions are self contradictory.
Reminds me of an old joke: Is hell exothermic or endothermic?

"First, we need to know how the mass of hell is changing in time. So we
need to know the rate at which souls are moving into hell and the rate
at which they are leaving. I think that we can safely assume that once a
soul gets to hell, it will not leave. Therefore, no souls are leaving.
As for how many souls are entering hell, let's look at the different
religions that exist in the world today.

"Most of these religions state that, if you are not a member of their
religion, you will go to hell.

"Since there is more than one of these religions and since people do not
belong to more than one religion, we can project that all souls go to
hell. With birth and death rates as they are, we can expect the number
of souls in hell to increase exponentially. Now, we look at the rate of
change of the volume in hell because Boyle's law states that in order
for the temperature and pressure in hell to stay the same, the volume of
hell has to expand proportionately as souls are added. This gives two
possibilities:

"1. If hell is expanding at a slower rate than the rate at which souls
enter hell, then the temperature and pressure in hell will increase
until all hell breaks loose.

"2. If hell is expanding at a rate faster than the increase of souls in
hell, then the temperature and pressure will drop until hell freezes over.

"So which is it? If we accept the postulate given to me by Teresa during
my freshman year that, 'It will be a cold day in hell before I sleep
with you', and take into account the fact that I slept with her last
night, then number two must be true, and thus I am sure that hell is
exothermic and has already frozen over.

"The corollary of this theory is that since hell has frozen over, it
follows that it is not accepting any more souls and is therefore,
extinct . . . leaving only heaven, thereby proving the existence of a
divine being which explains why, last night, Teresa kept shouting, 'Oh
my God!'."
GB
2018-05-14 10:50:55 UTC
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Post by GB
Can I just check something. All this antisemitism exaggeration you
complain about is according to you down to right wing Jews. I know you
support Momentum, so I guess that you must find that rather a lot of
people are further right than you, but does that make them right wing, I
wonder? I ask, because the chief concerns voiced about Ms Walker came ***
from the Jewish Labour Movement. Not an obviously right wing
organisation, but maybe they appear so from your perspective?
*** Came originally ...

BTW, is she still on the Momentum steering committee?
The Todal
2018-05-15 16:58:24 UTC
Permalink
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Post by GB
Post by GB
Can I just check something. All this antisemitism exaggeration you
complain about is according to you down to right wing Jews. I know you
support Momentum, so I guess that you must find that rather a lot of
people are further right than you, but does that make them right wing,
I wonder? I ask, because the chief concerns voiced about Ms Walker
came ***
from the Jewish Labour Movement. Not an obviously right wing
organisation, but maybe they appear so from your perspective?
*** Came originally ...
BTW, is she still on the Momentum steering committee?
Jackie Walker is no longer on the Momentum committee. She was
effectively sacked by Lansman because he thought she brought the
organisation into disrepute by attracting unfavourable publicity. She is
also suspended from the Labour Party and has been for many, many months.
The Todal
2018-05-15 16:55:33 UTC
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Post by GB
Post by The Todal
To say that the jewish religion demands that ever more land be stolen
from the Palestinians is as disgraceful a slur as the misconception
that Islam requires its followers to kill or enslave non-Muslims.
Of course, I didn't say that or mean that, as you well know. Sometimes,
you show signs of your training as a lawyer.
Post by The Todal
The twaddle from old religious books is widely, and rightly,
disregarded by the vast majority of people.
Logically, there can be no justification for the word 'rightly', as you
can't prove that God doesn't exist.
Post by The Todal
I don't suppose even one person in a million knows what she is
supposed to have said. But the vengeful Board of Deputies insists on
her expulsion nevertheless.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/14/labour-ken-livingstone-jackie-walker-antisemitism-row
Can I just check something. All this antisemitism exaggeration you
complain about is according to you down to right wing Jews. I know you
support Momentum, so I guess that you must find that rather a lot of
people are further right than you, but does that make them right wing, I
wonder? I ask, because the chief concerns voiced about Ms Walker came
from the Jewish Labour Movement. Not an obviously right wing
organisation, but maybe they appear so from your perspective?
Perhaps a majority of the parliamentary labour party appear right wing
to you?
The Jewish Labour Movement is an organisation of wankers. If you are
interested in making contact with Labour jews who are critical of Israel
and who support justice for the Palestinians, try Jewish Voice for
Labour and Jews for Jeremy.

I suppose you probably haven't cottoned on to the fact that in the
Labour Party the right wing jews who oppose Corbyn are hyping up the
phoney antisemitism scandal as a way to get rid of him. They believe
that criticisms of Israel are likely to be motivated by antisemitism.
And the Jewish Labour Movement is a key part of that campaign. When you
check out their website you can see the following, which gives the game
away:

quote

The Jewish Labour Movement is a membership organisation of Labour
supporting members of the Jewish Community. A formal affiliate of the
Labour Party in the Uk since 1920, JLM campaigns within the party and
the wider community to support labour values within the UK, Israel and
Internationally.

In addition to the UK Labour Party, the Jewish Labour Movement is also
affiliated to the Board of Deputies of British Jews, the Zionist
Federation of the UK, and organise within the World Zionist Organisation
alongside our sister party in Israel, Havodah - the Israeli Labor Party.

snip

Our objects:

To maintain and promote Labour or Socialist Zionism as the movement
for self-determination of the Jewish people within the state of Israel.

Our values:

To promote the centrality of Israel in Jewish life and its development
on the basis of freedom, social justice and equality for all its citizens.
pensive hamster
2018-05-15 18:41:56 UTC
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Raw Message
On Tuesday, 15 May 2018 17:55:36 UTC+1, The Todal wrote:
[...]
Post by The Todal
The Jewish Labour Movement is an organisation of wankers. If you are
interested in making contact with Labour jews who are critical of Israel
and who support justice for the Palestinians, try Jewish Voice for
Labour and Jews for Jeremy.
Reminds me of a certain Monty Python sketch ...
GB
2018-05-16 09:28:55 UTC
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Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by The Todal
The Jewish Labour Movement is an organisation of wankers. If you are
interested in making contact with Labour jews who are critical of Israel
and who support justice for the Palestinians, try Jewish Voice for
Labour and Jews for Jeremy.
Reminds me of a certain Monty Python sketch ...
Which sketch?

The whole concept of 'Justice for Palestinians' is unhelpful, in my very
humble opinion. It's simply not possible to undo the last 70 years of
history. Of course, we all feel sorry for the Palestinians, but there
needs to be some realism in this. The Israelis are not going to pack up
camp and go home, and they will oppose any suggestion that they should
do so.

It's far more positive to promote a two state peaceful solution to the
current war. However, at the moment, both sides seem to be pursuing
policies deliberately designed to antagonise the other.
The Todal
2018-05-16 10:51:40 UTC
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Post by GB
Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by The Todal
The Jewish Labour Movement is an organisation of wankers. If you are
interested in making contact with Labour jews who are critical of Israel
and who support justice for the Palestinians, try Jewish Voice for
Labour and Jews for Jeremy.
Reminds me of a certain Monty Python sketch ...
Which sketch?
The whole concept of 'Justice for Palestinians' is unhelpful, in my very
humble opinion. It's simply not possible to undo the last 70 years of
history.  Of course, we all feel sorry for the Palestinians, but there
needs to be some realism in this. The Israelis are not going to pack up
camp and go home, and they will oppose any suggestion that they should
do so.
It's far more positive to promote a two state peaceful solution to the
current war. However, at the moment, both sides seem to be pursuing
policies deliberately designed to antagonise the other.
This year will mark the 70th anniversary of the forced displacement of
the Palestinians caused by the violent creation of Israel, when 750,000
Palestinians became refugees virtually overnight. Their descendants
number 7 million today. They owned 93% of the land in 1948 and lost 78%
of it, over 4m acres. About 400 villages were destroyed.

To coincide with a Palestinian demonstration to mark the event, Donald
Trump decided to open his latest hotel/casino - the new American Embassy
which he decided must be sited in the disputed city of Jerusalem.

Was that a positive move? Hardly. Was it predictable that this would
intensify the fury of the demonstrators? Of course.

I don't think they give a fuck whether you "feel sorry" for them. They
would prefer it if you chose not to perpetuate the lie that the only
motivation of Palestinians is to destroy Israel completely. Israel has
repeatedly been condemned by the UN for continuing to seize Palestinian
land and to evict the Palestinian owners. It would be a useful first
step if Israel's loyal allies imposed some discipline on the right wing
Israeli government.

I don't think you'll ever see the Board of Deputies of British Jews
uttering any word of condemnation for the actions of the Israeli
government. Maybe it should man up, stop grovelling to the
Israeli-supporters and be the sort of good friend to Israel that
involves telling them when they are wrong.

As for the Israeli press, it is far more critical of its government than
our spineless press.

I'll quote, because I have a subscription.

https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-what-kind-of-a-man-grins-like-that-1.6093255

Opinion: What Kind of a Man Grins Like That, Knowing the Gaza Death Toll
Is Rising by Ten an Hour?

All of Netanyahu's Zionist wishes just came true. Killings and all

What kind of man grins like a kid in a candy store, knowing that in
Gaza, the death toll is rising by ten Palestinians every hour? Knowing
that just outside Gaza, thousands of Israelis are under grave
trepidation for their families, their neighbors, their future.

Okay, he was busy at the time, helping the Trump administration formally
open a U.S. embassy in Jerusalem.

But what kind of man talks like this, at a time like this?

As Netanyahu spoke, the casualty count mounted, eventually reaching 60
dead and well over a thousand wounded, many if not most by sniper fire.

What kind of man, well-read, well-spoken, aware of irony wherever he
sees it, chooses just that moment to tell this kind of anecdote:

At the age of three, Netanyahu told the crowd in a memory of growing up
near what is now the embassy, "I would approach this place right here,
but only so far, because my mother told me, ‘You can’t go any further.’
This was near the border. It was exposed to sniper fire. That was then.
This is now, today."

What is this man made of? He does not think like other people. He has a
vision and a way of operating which are his alone. He has hopes and
wishes and dreams and goals for himself and for Zionism which he has
harbored for the length of his decades-long career.

And now, in the space of barely a week, his every Zionist and personal
wish list just came true.

This is a man who found in 2016 that he could gain popularity by openly
siding with IDF medic Elor Azaria, who, on his own initiative, carried
out a field execution against an incapacitated terrorist.

This is a man who then found he could further enhance his power by
undermining his own army chief and firing his defense minister, because
they insisted on prosecuting Azaria for violating the IDF's rules of
engagement.

This is a man, that is, who has found he can benefit from the deaths of
Palestinians – provided he can titrate the killings to what an
increasingly sympathetic press calls a "reasonable'" level.

This was a man who for months this year pointedly turned aside the pleas
of senior army brass, who repeatedly urged Netanyahu to act immediately
to address a crippling humanitarian crisis in Gaza – lest the Strip boil
over into mass unrest. They gave ample evidence of the dismal plight of
Gaza's two million residents, driven to new depths of desperation by
high unemployment, infrastructure collapse and lack of opportunity.

Netanyahu's response? Banning officials from using the term
"humanitarian crisis."
JNugent
2018-05-16 10:57:13 UTC
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On 16/05/2018 11:51, The Todal wrote:

[ ... ]
Post by The Todal
This year will mark the 70th anniversary of the
...foundation of the state of Israel.
Post by The Todal
To coincide with a Palestinian demonstration to mark the event, Donald
Trump decided to open his latest hotel/casino - the new American Embassy
which he decided must be sited in the disputed city of Jerusalem.
Was there a grown-up point buried somewhere within that childish scream?
pensive hamster
2018-05-16 14:51:27 UTC
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Post by GB
Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by The Todal
The Jewish Labour Movement is an organisation of wankers. If you are
interested in making contact with Labour jews who are critical of Israel
and who support justice for the Palestinians, try Jewish Voice for
Labour and Jews for Jeremy.
Reminds me of a certain Monty Python sketch ...
Which sketch?

Life of Brian - The People's Front of Judea

-----------------------------------
http://montypython.50webs.com/scripts/Life_of_Brian/8.htm

BRIAN: Are you the Judean People's Front?

REG: Fuck off!

BRIAN: What?

REG: Judean People's Front. We're the People's Front of Judea! Judean People's Front. Cawk.

FRANCIS: Wankers.

BRIAN: Can I... join your group?

REG: No. Piss off.

BRIAN: I didn't want to sell this stuff. It's only a job. I hate the Romans as much as anybody.

PEOPLE'S FRONT OF JUDEA: Shhhh. Shhhh. Shhh. Shh. Shhhh.

REG: Stumm.

JUDITH: Are you sure?

BRIAN: Oh, dead sure. I hate the Romans already.

REG: Listen. If you wanted to join the P.F.J., you'd have to really hate the Romans.

BRIAN: I do!

REG: Oh, yeah? How much?

BRIAN: A lot!

REG: Right. You're in. Listen. The only people we hate more than the Romans are the fucking Judean People's Front.

P.F.J.: Yeah...

JUDITH: Splitters.

P.F.J.: Splitters...

FRANCIS: And the Judean Popular People's Front.

P.F.J.: Yeah. Oh, yeah. Splitters. Splitters...

LORETTA: And the People's Front of Judea.

P.F.J.: Yeah. Splitters. Splitters...

REG: What?

LORETTA: The People's Front of Judea. Splitters.

REG: We're the People's Front of Judea!

LORETTA: Oh. I thought we were the Popular Front.

REG: People's Front! C-huh.

FRANCIS: Whatever happened to the Popular Front, Reg?

REG: He's over there.

P.F.J.: Splitter!

The Todal
2018-05-16 10:14:25 UTC
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Post by pensive hamster
[...]
Post by The Todal
The Jewish Labour Movement is an organisation of wankers. If you are
interested in making contact with Labour jews who are critical of Israel
and who support justice for the Palestinians, try Jewish Voice for
Labour and Jews for Jeremy.
Reminds me of a certain Monty Python sketch ...
Indeed yes. People's Front of Judea. Judean People's Front. Which I'm
sure was based on the Python team's experience of Labour student
politics at Oxford and Cambridge.
GB
2018-05-16 09:11:30 UTC
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Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
To say that the jewish religion demands that ever more land be stolen
from the Palestinians is as disgraceful a slur as the misconception
that Islam requires its followers to kill or enslave non-Muslims.
Of course, I didn't say that or mean that, as you well know.
Sometimes, you show signs of your training as a lawyer.
Post by The Todal
The twaddle from old religious books is widely, and rightly,
disregarded by the vast majority of people.
Logically, there can be no justification for the word 'rightly', as
you can't prove that God doesn't exist.
Post by The Todal
I don't suppose even one person in a million knows what she is
supposed to have said. But the vengeful Board of Deputies insists on
her expulsion nevertheless.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/14/labour-ken-livingstone-jackie-walker-antisemitism-row
Can I just check something. All this antisemitism exaggeration you
complain about is according to you down to right wing Jews. I know you
support Momentum, so I guess that you must find that rather a lot of
people are further right than you, but does that make them right wing,
I wonder? I ask, because the chief concerns voiced about Ms Walker
came from the Jewish Labour Movement. Not an obviously right wing
organisation, but maybe they appear so from your perspective?
Perhaps a majority of the parliamentary labour party appear right wing
to you?
The Jewish Labour Movement is an organisation of wankers. If you are
interested in making contact with Labour jews who are critical of Israel
and who support justice for the Palestinians, try Jewish Voice for
Labour and Jews for Jeremy.
I suppose you probably haven't cottoned on to the fact that in the
Labour Party the right wing jews who oppose Corbyn are hyping up the
phoney antisemitism scandal as a way to get rid of him. They believe
that criticisms of Israel are likely to be motivated by antisemitism.
And the Jewish Labour Movement is a key part of that campaign. When you
check out their website you can see the following, which gives the game
quote
The Jewish Labour Movement is a membership organisation of Labour
supporting members of the Jewish Community. A formal affiliate of the
Labour Party in the Uk since 1920, JLM campaigns within the party and
the wider community to support labour values within the UK, Israel and
Internationally.
In addition to the UK Labour Party, the Jewish Labour Movement is also
affiliated to the Board of Deputies of British Jews, the Zionist
Federation of the UK, and organise within the World Zionist Organisation
alongside our sister party in Israel, Havodah - the Israeli Labor Party.
snip
    To maintain and promote Labour or Socialist Zionism as the movement
for self-determination of the Jewish people within the state of Israel.
To promote the centrality of Israel in Jewish life and its development
on the basis of freedom, social justice and equality for all its citizens.
"Gives the game away" - how clever of you to work out their stance from
those few subtle clues!

It's very odd to label them as right wing from any of that, although
they are clearly Zionist. You probably need to adjust your use of the
term 'right wing', as it's confusing the hell out of everyone else!
The Todal
2018-05-16 10:16:57 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
Post by GB
Post by The Todal
To say that the jewish religion demands that ever more land be
stolen from the Palestinians is as disgraceful a slur as the
misconception that Islam requires its followers to kill or enslave
non-Muslims.
Of course, I didn't say that or mean that, as you well know.
Sometimes, you show signs of your training as a lawyer.
Post by The Todal
The twaddle from old religious books is widely, and rightly,
disregarded by the vast majority of people.
Logically, there can be no justification for the word 'rightly', as
you can't prove that God doesn't exist.
Post by The Todal
I don't suppose even one person in a million knows what she is
supposed to have said. But the vengeful Board of Deputies insists on
her expulsion nevertheless.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/14/labour-ken-livingstone-jackie-walker-antisemitism-row
Can I just check something. All this antisemitism exaggeration you
complain about is according to you down to right wing Jews. I know
you support Momentum, so I guess that you must find that rather a lot
of people are further right than you, but does that make them right
wing, I wonder? I ask, because the chief concerns voiced about Ms
Walker came from the Jewish Labour Movement. Not an obviously right
wing organisation, but maybe they appear so from your perspective?
Perhaps a majority of the parliamentary labour party appear right
wing to you?
The Jewish Labour Movement is an organisation of wankers. If you are
interested in making contact with Labour jews who are critical of
Israel and who support justice for the Palestinians, try Jewish Voice
for Labour and Jews for Jeremy.
I suppose you probably haven't cottoned on to the fact that in the
Labour Party the right wing jews who oppose Corbyn are hyping up the
phoney antisemitism scandal as a way to get rid of him. They believe
that criticisms of Israel are likely to be motivated by antisemitism.
And the Jewish Labour Movement is a key part of that campaign. When
you check out their website you can see the following, which gives the
quote
The Jewish Labour Movement is a membership organisation of Labour
supporting members of the Jewish Community. A formal affiliate of the
Labour Party in the Uk since 1920, JLM campaigns within the party and
the wider community to support labour values within the UK, Israel and
Internationally.
In addition to the UK Labour Party, the Jewish Labour Movement is also
affiliated to the Board of Deputies of British Jews, the Zionist
Federation of the UK, and organise within the World Zionist
Organisation alongside our sister party in Israel, Havodah - the
Israeli Labor Party.
snip
     To maintain and promote Labour or Socialist Zionism as the
movement for self-determination of the Jewish people within the state
of Israel.
To promote the centrality of Israel in Jewish life and its development
on the basis of freedom, social justice and equality for all its citizens.
"Gives the game away" - how clever of you to work out their stance from
those few subtle clues!
It's very odd to label them as right wing from any of that, although
they are clearly Zionist. You probably need to adjust your use of the
term 'right wing', as it's confusing the hell out of everyone else!
Right wing jews are the dullards currently telling everyone (in social
media) that Israel was right to open fire on unarmed demonstrators
earlier this week. That if the army hadn't shot all those people they
would have broken through the fence and massacred innocent Israeli
townsfolk.

I call them right wing, but you might have another name for them. Nazis?
No, we're not allowed to compare modern Israeli politics to Nazism
because it has been declared to be antisemitic to do so.
GB
2018-05-16 12:12:39 UTC
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Post by The Todal
Post by GB
It's very odd to label them as right wing from any of that, although
they are clearly Zionist. You probably need to adjust your use of the
term 'right wing', as it's confusing the hell out of everyone else!
Right wing jews are the dullards currently telling everyone (in social
media) that Israel was right to open fire on unarmed demonstrators
earlier this week. That if the army hadn't shot all those people they
would have broken through the fence and massacred innocent Israeli
townsfolk.
I call them right wing, but you might have another name for them.
Seeing as they are Labour Party members, it would be usual to label them
left wing, and you have not said a single word to justify anything else.
Post by The Todal
Nazis?
No, we're not allowed to compare modern Israeli politics to Nazism
because it has been declared to be antisemitic to do so.
I think it's simply daft to make that comparison, as it accomplishes zero.

I couldn't defend shooting civilians, but I also couldn't pass judgement
on the small contingent of 17 year old recruits charged with defending
their border post against 40,000 angry civilians. I suspect that, in
their position, the first thing I would do is crap in my pants.
Following that, I'd probably panic and fire off every round I had.
Sam Clark
2018-05-14 14:52:42 UTC
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Post by The Todal
The new President of the Board of Deputies has announced that Labour
must expel both Ken Livingstone and Jackie Walker. Most people know the
case against Ken Livingstone and now that both George Galloway and Shami
Chakrabarti have expressed the hope that he'll be thrown out of the
party, it's obvious that his support is ebbing away because the arrogant
old man won't acknowledge the offence he has caused.
I don't know why you don't like Ken. Here is a well argued piece on the
issue.

<http://labourpartymarxists.org.uk/anti-zionism-does-not-equal-anti-semitism-2/>
Post by The Todal
But Jackie Walker is actually innocent of any charges of antisemitism
and the persecution of her is a silly knee-jerk reaction by ignorant
zealots.  There isn't even a rational debate about Walker. I don't
suppose even one person in a million knows what she is supposed to have
said. But the vengeful Board of Deputies insists on her expulsion
nevertheless.
Jackie is not "innocent". She has voiced direct opposition to the IHRA
definition of antisemitism.

She has stated that she believes Israel is an inherently racist state
and is hence an antisemite using the IHRA definition. See the provided
examples given in:

<https://www.ngo-monitor.org/ihra-adopts-new-working-definition-antisemitism/>


She is eloquent and convincing, which I suspect is the problem.

My own conclusion is that it is time to stop using the word antisemite
and that it would be clearer to address anti-Jewish bigotry and
discrimination using standard categories such as racist or religious hatred.
The Todal
2018-05-15 17:05:57 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by Sam Clark
Post by The Todal
The new President of the Board of Deputies has announced that Labour
must expel both Ken Livingstone and Jackie Walker. Most people know
the case against Ken Livingstone and now that both George Galloway and
Shami Chakrabarti have expressed the hope that he'll be thrown out of
the party, it's obvious that his support is ebbing away because the
arrogant old man won't acknowledge the offence he has caused.
I don't know why you don't like Ken. Here is a well argued piece on the
issue.
<http://labourpartymarxists.org.uk/anti-zionism-does-not-equal-anti-semitism-2/>
I do like Ken. I know he isn't an antisemite. But he has helped to
foster the hysterical belief that there are antisemites under the bed,
by his injudicious remarks. An experienced politician should know better.
Post by Sam Clark
Post by The Todal
But Jackie Walker is actually innocent of any charges of antisemitism
and the persecution of her is a silly knee-jerk reaction by ignorant
zealots.  There isn't even a rational debate about Walker. I don't
suppose even one person in a million knows what she is supposed to
have said. But the vengeful Board of Deputies insists on her expulsion
nevertheless.
Jackie is not "innocent". She has voiced direct opposition to the IHRA
definition of antisemitism.
No, only to the "examples" tacked on to the end of the definition.In
objecting to those, she is in very good company. Including that of
jewish former Court of Appeal judge Stephen Sedley.
Post by Sam Clark
She has stated that she believes Israel is an inherently racist state
and is hence an antisemite using the IHRA definition. See the provided
<https://www.ngo-monitor.org/ihra-adopts-new-working-definition-antisemitism/>
She is eloquent and convincing, which I suspect is the problem.
She had a jewish father and a Jamaican non-jewish mother. Jews regard
her as a non-jew and aren't interested in her actual views, only in her
designated role as another sacrificial victim.
Post by Sam Clark
My own conclusion is that it is time to stop using the word antisemite
and that it would be clearer to address anti-Jewish bigotry and
discrimination using standard categories such as racist or religious hatred.
There is a lot to be said for that.
GB
2018-05-16 09:32:40 UTC
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She had a jewish father and a Jamaican non-jewish mother.  Jews regard
her as a non-jew and aren't interested in her actual views, only in her
designated role as another sacrificial victim.
"Jews regard her as a non-jew" - it's interesting that you claim to
represent all Jews in this. I'm surprised.
The Todal
2018-05-16 10:20:36 UTC
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Post by GB
She had a jewish father and a Jamaican non-jewish mother.  Jews regard
her as a non-jew and aren't interested in her actual views, only in
her designated role as another sacrificial victim.
"Jews regard her as a non-jew" - it's interesting that you claim to
represent all Jews in this. I'm surprised.
Don't be obtuse. You presumably know that within the jewish religion you
are only a real jew if your mother was jewish.

That's critically important to right wing jews who are demonising her.
I'm assuming that you don't bother to follow the vigorous debates that
take place in social media or the poisonous edicts issued by the
Campaign Against Antisemitism, so I'm trying to save you a bit of time
and trouble.
Judith
2018-05-08 23:10:28 UTC
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Post by Sam Clark
Post by GB
Nice pun, but what point are you making?
Ken Livingstone started the ball rolling.  I don't think he is
necessarily antisemitic, just very, very tactless. And the process has
continued. So, a load of Labour supporters are pissed off and haven't
voted Labour. Who'd have expected that cause and effect?
I don't know how you deduce Ken "started" anything.
Given you appear to accept Ken's comments weren't antisemitic can you
point to an actual Labour antisemite, deserving to be expelled.
Tony Greenstein,
Jackie Walker,
Moshé Machov,
Miko Peled,
Ken Loach,
Christine Shawcroft,
Alan Bull,
Mark Wadsworth.
Which accusations do you support and can you explain why? or do you have
your own example of Labour antisemitism.
Why don't you tell us what each of them has said which is anti-Semitic - rather
than anti-the state of Israel.


There is a difference you know.

Over to you.
Sam Clark
2018-05-09 10:17:36 UTC
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Post by Judith
Post by Sam Clark
Tony Greenstein,
Jackie Walker,
Moshé Machov,
Miko Peled,
Ken Loach,
Christine Shawcroft,
Alan Bull,
Mark Wadsworth.
Which accusations do you support and can you explain why? or do you have
your own example of Labour antisemitism.
Why don't you tell us what each of them has said which is anti-Semitic - rather
than anti-the state of Israel.
I haven't seen anything in these main cases deserving expulsion, a few
perhaps were slightly rude. That is why I was asking.

Personally I'm at the "Boy who cried wolf stage" but was wondering if
anyone could convince me otherwise.

Ruth Smeeth mentioned some nasty social media comments in her speech to
the House of Commons. However is seemed strange to me that she
considered this so significant as most of the people I know on social
media have been called far worse.

Have you never been abused on social media?
Post by Judith
There is a difference you know.
Are you sure of that? Criticism of Israel now seems to be a subset of
antisemitism.

Whilst the relatively precise Zio has been banned (Trot is still
allowed) antisemitism has been redefined. The new definition was
accepted by Mrs May in 2016.

<https://www.ngo-monitor.org/ihra-adopts-new-working-definition-antisemitism/>

It is an astonishing document. It takes identity politics to a new
level. Socially acceptable views and "accepted truth" are imposed by
diktat rather than reasoned argument and consensus.
The Todal
2018-05-08 16:15:27 UTC
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Post by pamela
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/c95egxx8738t/barnet-london-borough-council
--
I don't really care about keeping the Tory jews of Barnet happy. They
want to vote Tory and nothing is going to persuade them that Labour is
the party for them.

Whereas in Hackney
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/cn1r2wdermgt/hackney-london-borough-council

In Redbridge where there is a huge jewish electorate
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/cv8k1e8x6x4t/redbridge-london-borough-council
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