Discussion:
Leather knee patches for Fox
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R. Mark Clayton
2018-03-09 15:31:48 UTC
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Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free trade deals with [the other] half the world?

Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the UK to be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and aluminium.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-british-trade-secretary-jets-12154973
pamela
2018-03-09 21:04:44 UTC
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On 15:31 9 Mar 2018, R. Mark Clayton wrote:

> Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free trade
> deals with [the other] half the world?
>
> Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the UK to
> be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and aluminium.
>
> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-british-trade-secr
> etary-jets-12154973

Why doesn't Liam Fox just let the EU negotiatate this with America?
The EU isn't frightened of what Donald Trump attempts but Liam Fox is.

I wonder how the UK would sort this out after Brexit. Send Nigel
Farage? Nigel also used to be a metal commodities broker. lol
tim...
2018-03-10 11:46:59 UTC
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"pamela" <***@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:***@81.171.118.178...
> On 15:31 9 Mar 2018, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>
>> Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free trade
>> deals with [the other] half the world?
>>
>> Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the UK to
>> be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and aluminium.
>>
>> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-british-trade-secr
>> etary-jets-12154973
>
> Why doesn't Liam Fox just let the EU negotiatate this with America?

because the EU has no cards to play here

> The EU isn't frightened of what Donald Trump attempts but Liam Fox is.

Oh no he isn't

tim
R. Mark Clayton
2018-03-10 12:09:50 UTC
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On Saturday, 10 March 2018 11:48:12 UTC, tim... wrote:
> "pamela" <***@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:***@81.171.118.178...
> > On 15:31 9 Mar 2018, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
> >
> >> Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free trade
> >> deals with [the other] half the world?
> >>
> >> Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the UK to
> >> be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and aluminium.
> >>
> >> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-british-trade-secr
> >> etary-jets-12154973
> >
> > Why doesn't Liam Fox just let the EU negotiatate this with America?
>
> because the EU has no cards to play here

Dunno - could tax anything American - 787's, iPhones etc.

>
> > The EU isn't frightened of what Donald Trump attempts but Liam Fox is.
>
> Oh no he isn't

The EU will certainly be anxious about numpty trumpty's impetuousness, which could severely damage important industries in the EU (e.g. German stell and car producers).

Liam Fox should be worried about this too - we already had the 300% tax on Shorts' aircraft, which if the legals had been right would have likely closed the factory.

OTOH the reason Liam Fox should have his leather knee patches sown on his brown trousers is that Trump slapping tariffs ON British Steel, aircraft and other goods is the exact opposite of the free and easy trading the UK would have with the rest of the world he promises if it left the EU and makes him look like the total d**k he is.

>
> tim



** or
pamela
2018-03-10 12:51:51 UTC
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On 12:09 10 Mar 2018, R. Mark Clayton wrote:

> On Saturday, 10 March 2018 11:48:12 UTC, tim... wrote:
>> "pamela" <***@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:***@81.171.118.178...
>> > On 15:31 9 Mar 2018, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>> >
>> >> Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free
>> >> trade deals with [the other] half the world?
>> >>
>> >> Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the
>> >> UK to be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and
>> >> aluminium.
>> >>
>> >> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-
>> >> british-trade-secretary-jets-12154973
>> >
>> > Why doesn't Liam Fox just let the EU negotiatate this with
>> > America?
>>
>> because the EU has no cards to play here
>
> Dunno - could tax anything American - 787's, iPhones etc.

The list of countermeasures is almost endless. Especially
discriminatory tariffs or barriers on US tech services such as
Amazon.

What is Britain planning to do? Perhaps launch a WTO complaint and
wait a few years to see what gets decided, while our steel companies
go bankrupt.

>> > The EU isn't frightened of what Donald Trump attempts but Liam
>> > Fox is.
>>
>> Oh no he isn't
>
> The EU will certainly be anxious about numpty trumpty's
> impetuousness, which could severely damage important industries in
> the EU (e.g. German stell and car producers).
>
> Liam Fox should be worried about this too - we already had the
> 300% tax on Shorts' aircraft, which if the legals had been right
> would have likely closed the factory.

The UK had no leverage over the US when it imposed 300% tariffs but
luckily the dispute got resolved for us. Our special relationship
didn't count for much.

> OTOH the reason Liam Fox should have his leather knee patches sown
> on his brown trousers is that Trump slapping tariffs ON British
> Steel, aircraft and other goods is the exact opposite of the free
> and easy trading the UK would have with the rest of the world he
> promises if it left the EU and makes him look like the total d**k
> he is.

It's a tough world out there and it's getting tougher. Britain is
going to struggle. Where's all that extra cash to make us rich
going to come from as promised by Brexiteers from dealing with the
rest of the world?




--

The wheels are coming off the Brexit clown car
tim...
2018-03-10 13:34:22 UTC
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"R. Mark Clayton" <***@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:10729191-8541-49be-9347-***@googlegroups.com...
> On Saturday, 10 March 2018 11:48:12 UTC, tim... wrote:
>> "pamela" <***@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:***@81.171.118.178...
>> > On 15:31 9 Mar 2018, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>> >
>> >> Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free trade
>> >> deals with [the other] half the world?
>> >>
>> >> Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the UK to
>> >> be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and aluminium.
>> >>
>> >> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-british-trade-secr
>> >> etary-jets-12154973
>> >
>> > Why doesn't Liam Fox just let the EU negotiatate this with America?
>>
>> because the EU has no cards to play here
>
> Dunno - could tax anything American - 787's, iPhones etc.

you think trump will care less?

>> > The EU isn't frightened of what Donald Trump attempts but Liam Fox is.
>>
>> Oh no he isn't
>
> The EU will certainly be anxious about numpty trumpty's impetuousness,
> which could severely damage important industries in the EU (e.g. German
> stell and car producers).

but what can they do

how does taxing iPhone sell more cars.

the damage is done

> Liam Fox should be worried about this too

of course,

that doesn't mean he doesn't have as good a hand as the EU (i.e none at
all)

>- we already had the 300% tax on Shorts' aircraft,

successfully defended

> which if the legals had been right would have likely closed the factory.
>
> OTOH the reason Liam Fox should have his leather knee patches sown on his
> brown trousers is that Trump slapping tariffs ON British Steel, aircraft
> and other goods is the exact opposite of the free and easy trading the UK
> would have with the rest of the world he promises if it left the EU and
> makes him look like the total d**k he is.

The Trump era is time limited

he will be gone before any US Trade Agreement reaches its implementation
date

tim
Lancer
2018-03-10 14:14:50 UTC
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On 10/03/2018 13:34, tim... wrote:
>
>
> "R. Mark Clayton" <***@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:10729191-8541-49be-9347-***@googlegroups.com...
>> On Saturday, 10 March 2018 11:48:12 UTC, tim... wrote:
>>> "pamela" <***@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:***@81.171.118.178...
>>> > On 15:31 9 Mar 2018, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free trade
>>> >> deals with [the other] half the world?
>>> >>
>>> >> Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the UK to
>>> >> be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and aluminium.
>>> >>
>>> >> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-british-trade-secr
>>> >> etary-jets-12154973
>>> >
>>> > Why doesn't Liam Fox just let the EU negotiatate this with America?
>>>
>>> because the EU has no cards to play here
>>
>> Dunno - could tax anything American - 787's, iPhones etc.
>
> you think trump will care less?
>
>>> > The EU isn't frightened of what Donald Trump attempts but Liam Fox is.
>>>
>>> Oh no he isn't
>>
>> The EU will certainly be anxious about numpty trumpty's impetuousness,
>> which could severely damage important industries in the EU (e.g.
>> German stell and car producers).
>
> but what can they do
>
> how does taxing iPhone sell more cars.
>
> the damage is done
>
>> Liam Fox should be worried about this too
>
> of course,
>
> that doesn't mean he doesn't have as good a hand as the EU (i.e none at
> all)
>
>> - we already had the 300% tax on Shorts' aircraft,
>
> successfully defended

You mean defeated by the US Trade Commission.

>
>> which if the legals had been right would have likely closed the factory.
>>
>> OTOH the reason Liam Fox should have his leather knee patches sown on
>> his brown trousers is that Trump slapping tariffs ON British Steel,
>> aircraft and other goods is the exact opposite of the free and easy
>> trading the UK would have with the rest of the world he promises if it
>> left the EU and makes him look like the total d**k he is.
>
> The Trump era is time limited
>
> he will be gone before any US Trade Agreement reaches its implementation
> date
>

In the mean time Trump will be in charge of negotiations.
tim...
2018-03-10 19:20:13 UTC
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"Lancer" <***@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:p80p8t$o06$***@dont-email.me...
> On 10/03/2018 13:34, tim... wrote:
>>
>>
>> "R. Mark Clayton" <***@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:10729191-8541-49be-9347-***@googlegroups.com...
>>> On Saturday, 10 March 2018 11:48:12 UTC, tim... wrote:
>>>> "pamela" <***@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:***@81.171.118.178...
>>>> > On 15:31 9 Mar 2018, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free trade
>>>> >> deals with [the other] half the world?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the UK to
>>>> >> be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and aluminium.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-british-trade-secr
>>>> >> etary-jets-12154973
>>>> >
>>>> > Why doesn't Liam Fox just let the EU negotiatate this with America?
>>>>
>>>> because the EU has no cards to play here
>>>
>>> Dunno - could tax anything American - 787's, iPhones etc.
>>
>> you think trump will care less?
>>
>>>> > The EU isn't frightened of what Donald Trump attempts but Liam Fox
>>>> > is.
>>>>
>>>> Oh no he isn't
>>>
>>> The EU will certainly be anxious about numpty trumpty's impetuousness,
>>> which could severely damage important industries in the EU (e.g.
>>> German stell and car producers).
>>
>> but what can they do
>>
>> how does taxing iPhone sell more cars.
>>
>> the damage is done
>>
>>> Liam Fox should be worried about this too
>>
>> of course,
>>
>> that doesn't mean he doesn't have as good a hand as the EU (i.e none at
>> all)
>>
>>> - we already had the 300% tax on Shorts' aircraft,
>>
>> successfully defended
>
> You mean defeated by the US Trade Commission.
>
>>
>>> which if the legals had been right would have likely closed the factory.
>>>
>>> OTOH the reason Liam Fox should have his leather knee patches sown on
>>> his brown trousers is that Trump slapping tariffs ON British Steel,
>>> aircraft and other goods is the exact opposite of the free and easy
>>> trading the UK would have with the rest of the world he promises if it
>>> left the EU and makes him look like the total d**k he is.
>>
>> The Trump era is time limited
>>
>> he will be gone before any US Trade Agreement reaches its implementation
>> date
>>
>
> In the mean time Trump will be in charge of negotiations.

That's true

But the point under discussion is Trump's current imposition of tariffs, in
spite of having a trade agreement with countries (in this case Canada and
Mexico) for zero tariffs on the items, proving that he wont stick to the
agreement once it is signed.

There is no risk of that happening to any FTA that we have with the USA,
because Trump will be gone by the time it is in operation.

tim
R. Mark Clayton
2018-03-11 10:49:10 UTC
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On Saturday, 10 March 2018 13:35:36 UTC, tim... wrote:
> "R. Mark Clayton" <***@gmail.com> wrote in message

SNIP

> >> because the EU has no cards to play here
> >
> > Dunno - could tax anything American - 787's, iPhones etc.
>
> you think trump will care less?

Dunno - he is not entirely rational.

>
> >> > The EU isn't frightened of what Donald Trump attempts but Liam Fox is.
> >>
> >> Oh no he isn't
> >
> > The EU will certainly be anxious about numpty trumpty's impetuousness,
> > which could severely damage important industries in the EU (e.g. German
> > stell and car producers).
>
> but what can they do
>
> how does taxing iPhone sell more cars.
>
> the damage is done

Trade wars only have losers, to quote Marshal of the Royal Air Force Sir Arthur Travers Harris "they have sown the wind..."

>
> > Liam Fox should be worried about this too
>
> of course,
>
> that doesn't mean he doesn't have as good a hand as the EU (i.e none at
> all)
>
> >- we already had the 300% tax on Shorts' aircraft,
>
> successfully defended

For the moment - averted on some legal technicality.

>
> > which if the legals had been right would have likely closed the factory.
> >
> > OTOH the reason Liam Fox should have his leather knee patches sown on his
> > brown trousers is that Trump slapping tariffs ON British Steel, aircraft
> > and other goods is the exact opposite of the free and easy trading the UK
> > would have with the rest of the world he promises if it left the EU and
> > makes him look like the total d**k he is.
>
> The Trump era is time limited
>
> he will be gone before any US Trade Agreement reaches its implementation
> date
>
> tim

Maybe to both, but damage will have been done.
pensive hamster
2018-03-09 21:04:58 UTC
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On Friday, 9 March 2018 15:31:50 UTC, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
> Remember when Liam Fox boasted about how he would get free trade deals with [the other] half the world?
>
> Instead he is off to Washington DC to grovel and beg for the UK to be left out of Trump's latest tariff hit on steel and aluminium.
>
> https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/panicking-british-trade-secretary-jets-12154973

We need a pointless grovel at this stage of the campaign.

(After Peter Cook)
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